# vinyl or paper metal bead?



## jimmy454888 (May 7, 2016)

Which is better to use for wrapping outside window and door corners and why......glued/stapled vinyl or paper backed metal?
Is there a definitive advantage for either one for durability and no cracking?


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

Mud on vinyl... trim Tex mud set low profile! Much stronger and more impact resistant than paper faced products.


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## jimmy454888 (May 7, 2016)

Would you also use glue... or just staples?


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

Mud set bead around window works great. 847 and staples are sweet on upper soffits. It's what ever you like with trim tex it's a good


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## mudslingr (Jul 18, 2010)

jimmy454888 said:


> Would you also use glue... or just staples?



No staples or spray glue required with mudset bead. Just mud. Add some Mud Max for extra strength.


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

If it has to be accurate let the hangar do it with metal and a laser and if it can be off slightly use tape on cuz a finisher gets confused with a laser. Rick would think he's at a Pink Floyd concert.


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## jimmy454888 (May 7, 2016)

Ok that pink floyd thing shooting off into left field is hilarious! 
What is mud max?


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## jimmy454888 (May 7, 2016)

Ok...no glue or staples
Vinyl mud set it is!


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

Mud max is a glue you add to your mix. Check the Trim Tex site.


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## jackleg (Jan 22, 2008)

i have use easy sand to set mud-set and it worked well.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

MrWillys said:


> If it has to be accurate let the hangar do it with metal and a laser and if it can be off slightly use tape on cuz a finisher gets confused with a laser. Rick would think he's at a Pink Floyd concert.


If I owned a laser level ? It would have exploded years ago! :whistling2:


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## VANMAN (Jan 14, 2011)

moore said:


> If I owned a laser level ? It would have exploded years ago! :whistling2:


I would get no work done if I used a laser level to check if everything is straight/Plum!!!:blink:
Its the guys before me that need it I should b allowed to get on with my work without all the bullsh*t that f*ckers leave me to try sort!:furious:


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

MrWillys said:


> If it has to be accurate let the hangar do it with metal and a laser and if it can be off slightly use tape on cuz a finisher gets confused with a laser. Rick would think he's at a Pink Floyd concert.





moore said:


> If I owned a laser level ? It would have exploded years ago! :whistling2:


Thank you for proving my point. I've done residential highrise where door openings have to be accurate so we screwed on the metal bead with plumb bobs. I've also done ceilings that got wood panels that had to be dead on.


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## endo_alley (Nov 2, 2013)

We always (budget allowing) check the sheetrock with either a straight edge or a long level before putting on bead. Make sure the wall is shimmed straight before beading, and back out screws and shim it if necessary. Also check wraps and bead with a square. Especially along baseboard, crown or sills. The most common problem to check for is when hangers leave "dog nut" sticking out on one side. Then hang the next piece over the "dog nuts" and bowing the corner. The verdict is still out on whether leveling and plumbing window wraps is best. I usually use the edge of the window stop as a guide for shimming. That way the reveal is consistent regardless of how well the window is set. The problem with this is that some window shade treatments require wraps or jamb extensions that are level/ plumb/ square to work properly.


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

This is a perfect example of when you laser on bead. This soffit had to align with these wood panels that have laminate on 5 sides with 1/4" gaps. The ceiling was an existing CRC and hat rack from 40 years ago. Tying it to my new work and getting it straight was a son of a female dog!


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

MrWillys said:


> This is a perfect example of when you laser on bead. This soffit had to align with these wood panels that have laminate on 5 sides with 1/4" gaps. The ceiling was an existing CRC and hat rack from 40 years ago. Tying it to my new work and getting it straight was a son of a female dog!


 Ever heard of a tape measure... I could have eyeballed it tho.....:whistling2:


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock 
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*  Re: Tricks of the Trade  *


 I CAN'T UNDERSTAND YOU FELLOWS,,,,,,,,,

I wouldn't take a laser to work,,,,, maybe to an orgy,,,,, but not to work,,,,


Jeezeee,,, its just drywall guys!!!!!! 
__________________
I refuse to torment my soul,,,over things I can't control


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

moore said:


> Ever heard of a tape measure... I could have eyeballed it tho.....:whistling2:


I have no problem with how you do things and if you want to do it twice that is your choice. They could scribe the panels to the waves and just back charge you for the added labor?

The 3 rules of drywall. The right way, the wrong way and the way to make it look good. Only the 3rd rule is important.


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## gordie (Nov 6, 2012)

Wonder how capt is doin


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

gordie said:


> Wonder how capt is doin


Wish we knew !!!


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## gordie (Nov 6, 2012)

I second that


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

For the best looking most durable window wraps, to this day nothing compares to good old metal vorner bead, clinched, fiber glass mesh tape the edge of the bead, first coat with durabond or any setting type compound, and be sure to draw shave the lift off lines.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

I always use trim tex tear away against the window frames, same thing mesh the edge of the bead.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Any paper bead is garbage... I just did 2 complex jobs at an airport with hydro bead (I didn't and wouldn't buy it) Ive fixed so much of that metel reinforced paper crap it is completely retarded.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Krsw85 said:


> I always use trim tex tear away against the window frames, same thing mesh the edge of the bead.


You said mesh!


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## gopherstateguy (Apr 8, 2012)

Krsw85 said:


> Any paper bead is garbage... I just did 2 complex jobs at an airport with hydro bead (I didn't and wouldn't buy it) Ive fixed so much of that metel reinforced paper crap it is completely retarded.


Paper faced metal and hydro bead are completely different animals. I would never trust anything that you don't apply with mud or tape after installing.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

What fo you use to sure up the edge of the corner and trim bead? My preference is all paper. Except the edge of the bead, I use mesh there because paper doesnt really like those areas.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

gopherstateguy said:


> Krsw85 said:
> 
> 
> > Any paper bead is garbage... I just did 2 complex jobs at an airport with hydro bead (I didn't and wouldn't buy it) Ive fixed so much of that metel reinforced paper crap it is completely retarded.
> ...


Yea they are different products, and I hate them both.... I have fixed so much of the metal reinforced paper bead that I won't use it. Maybe the newer products are better, but in my experience they always rust and fall apart.....


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

moore said:


> Krsw85 said:
> 
> 
> > I always use trim tex tear away against the window frames, same thing mesh the edge of the bead.
> ...


 So what do you use to sure up the edge of your bead? I prefer all paper tape except the edge of the bead, paper tape does not like those areas.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Lol I guess they do not do 20yr jobs every where.


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## gopherstateguy (Apr 8, 2012)

Krsw85 said:


> Yea they are different products, and I hate them both.... I have fixed so much of the metal reinforced paper bead that I won't use it. Maybe the newer products are better, but in my experience they always rust and fall apart.....


https://www.usg.com/content/usgcom/...-sheetrock-paper-faced-metal-corner-bead.html

Been using these since they came out and never have seen them rust or fall apart.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Kool, I may give it a try some day, the stuff I see rusting and falling apart is usually the off angle tape.... Id have to know what kind of metal was in it before I bought it. One thing know I dont like about it, you have to be particularly careful cleaning the bead corner with a knife, or anything for that matter... always get a little mud hanging on the corner, wet + paper + knife = damage. What I do like. It seams like this product eliminates any need for taping the edge as that part is already done for you.


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

They must put something in the mud on the East coast of the US?


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## VANMAN (Jan 14, 2011)

MrWillys said:


> They must put something in the mud on the East coast of the US?


Thinking the same LOL:blink:


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)




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## VANMAN (Jan 14, 2011)

MrWillys said:


>


Sound like there has been a few turds had a polish!!!!:thumbup::thumbup:


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

It could just be a moisture issue.... its really humid up here in the summer, and cold in the winter. Moisture has an affinity to cooler air so some days on an improperly insulated home water condenses on the wall.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Lol its not so bad, if its really ugly I just bid an hourly rate so that atleast I know I am making money..... Its mostly the old off angle stuff with metal strips that I see ending up really fuked up.


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## krafty (Jun 30, 2016)

NO COAT inside and outside TRIM TEX arches. Been using it since 07' NO call backs. 

Sent from my LGL16C using Tapatalk


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

I like the trim tex bead.... but definately I almost always use strait flex for off angles '04, zero call backs.....


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

krafty said:


> NO COAT inside and outside TRIM TEX arches. Been using it since 07' NO call backs.
> 
> Sent from my LGL16C using Tapatalk


Do you just coat the edge of it? One place I may decide to use No Coat in the future is extremely shallow vaulted ceiling angles. If its a really shallow angle I just use my 12" pan knife to give it a round finish with setting type compound, gives it a unique, old school plaster look. With No Coat I may be able to give it the sharp angle, If I ever get away from finishing them round, which looks really cool anyways. Its hard work pushing on a knife like that, but definately worth the effort when you see it all purdied up with paint.


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## endo_alley (Nov 2, 2013)

Krsw85 said:


> Do you just coat the edge of it? One place I may decide to use No Coat in the future is extremely shallow vaulted ceiling angles. If its a really shallow angle I just use my 12" pan knife to give it a round finish with setting type compound, gives it a unique, old school plaster look. With No Coat I may be able to give it the sharp angle, If I ever get away from finishing them round, which looks really cool anyways. Its hard work pushing on a knife like that, but definately worth the effort when you see it all purdied up with paint.


Nobody around here lets you get away with coving the b#stard angles. We make the straight and square. Even with plaster.


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

Ain't seen nobody round out a 45 in over a decade. Then again we used the ole bat wing lol. I use trim Tex mud set bead exclusively. No rust, dents, cracks, etc... If you had to fix your beads when others smashed into them you would switch too lol. Metal is fine as long as you don't fasten to the studs... Air stapler with divergent staples does a decent job . Paper faced is good stuff also... Good lamination, no cracking, but prone to damage.


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## krafty (Jun 30, 2016)

Yeah you are supposed to just coat the edge but depends on hollow
I roll mud on bead then stick it up then outside roll on. Perfect on vault lids, chalkline mud to line works pretty good if hanging is doçent.

Sent from my LGL16C using Tapatalk


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## krafty (Jun 30, 2016)

Decent my bad. If not more drastic measures.

Sent from my LGL16C using Tapatalk


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Up here plaster vaulted ceilings are almost exclusively round.... I dont know why they wouldn't it looks great, and like I said, I only do that if it extremely shallow.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

thefinisher said:


> Ain't seen nobody round out a 45 in over a decade. Then again we used the ole bat wing lol. I use trim Tex mud set bead exclusively. No rust, dents, cracks, etc... If you had to fix your beads when others smashed into them you would switch too lol. Metal is fine as long as you don't fasten to the studs... Air stapler with divergent staples does a decent job . Paper faced is good stuff also... Good lamination, no cracking, but prone to damage.


I just cut it, clinch it, and sure up the edge with mesh.... It sure can be a tough job fixing damaged metal bead...


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

thefinisher said:


> Ain't seen nobody round out a 45 in over a decade. Then again we used the ole bat wing lol. I use trim Tex mud set bead exclusively. No rust, dents, cracks, etc... If you had to fix your beads when others smashed into them you would switch too lol. Metal is fine as long as you don't fasten to the studs... Air stapler with divergent staples does a decent job . Paper faced is good stuff also... Good lamination, no cracking, but prone to damage.


We are talking about something thats really not much different than being flat cieling, 155 or 160° angle...


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

If you use the mud set bead that TF is talking about there is no damage to fix. It is the toughest bead I have ever seen.:thumbsup:


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

My bad 0 deg is flat so the one I did recently was like a 20 deg angle or so.... just really difficult to make it look right. I did end up with tje medium strait flex, that didnt help, its got to be the original, stiff heavy and no holes....


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Krsw85 said:


> thefinisher said:
> 
> 
> > Ain't seen nobody round out a 45 in over a decade. Then again we used the ole bat wing lol. I use trim Tex mud set bead exclusively. No rust, dents, cracks, etc... If you had to fix your beads when others smashed into them you would switch too lol. Metal is fine as long as you don't fasten to the studs... Air stapler with divergent staples does a decent job . Paper faced is good stuff also... Good lamination, no cracking, but prone to damage.
> ...


The mud set bead is that vinyl? I like doing vinyl petting it on with compound and first coat it in one shot.... I miss the nice clean sharp corner that you get with old metal bead though... then theres bull nose... that gets interesting when you have something so extravagant that you have to start coping the bead joints....


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

Yes it is vinyl. It actually has a sharper nose than metal bead...


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

My corner bead can beat up your corner bead?


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

MrWillys said:


> My corner bead can beat up your corner bead?


How much does DWT Pay you?


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

moore said:


> How much does DWT Pay you?


Millions


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Any chance I can get in on that?


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## VANMAN (Jan 14, 2011)

Rounded combs!!:thumbsup:


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Im actually pretty sure I've used it for, and thats what I noticed and liked was that the corner was a lot sharper than most vinyl bead.... It's not bad.... most vinyl that I've seen has that really round corner that I really do not like.... the paper bead im not into because I like to coat both sides at once and clean the very corner up while its still wet with the same knife I coat it with. Too easy to slice that paper when its wet....


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

VANMAN said:


> Rounded combs!!


Looks pretty good, the picture quality doesnt do it any justice.


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## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

MrWillys said:


> My corner bead can beat up your corner bead?





Krsw85 said:


> Im actually pretty sure I've used it for, and thats what I noticed and liked was that the corner was a lot sharper than most vinyl bead.... It's not bad.... most vinyl that I've seen has that really round corner that I really do not like.... the paper bead im not into because I like to coat both sides at once and clean the very corner up while its still wet with the same knife I coat it with. Too easy to slice that paper when its wet....


What part did you not get?


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Krsw85 said:


> Im actually pretty sure I've used it for, and thats what I noticed and liked was that the corner was a lot sharper than most vinyl bead.... It's not bad.... most vinyl that I've seen has that really round corner that I really do not like.... the paper bead im not into because I like to coat both sides at once and clean the very corner up while its still wet with the same knife I coat it with. Too easy to slice that paper when its wet....


Dude !!!! You are killing me! You can run paper face bead just like you do the outdated (nobody wants that chit anymore shiny 90s) but just don't be an animal about it. Take her easy bro!!


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Krsw85 said:


> Im actually pretty sure I've used it for, and thats what I noticed and liked was that the corner was a lot sharper than most vinyl bead.... It's not bad.... most vinyl that I've seen has that really round corner that I really do not like.... the paper bead im not into because I like to coat both sides at once and clean the very corner up while its still wet with the same knife I coat it with. Too easy to slice that paper when its wet....


 Like moore said but WTF mate?? Ive been using papermetal for 19years, Coat both sides and clean the very corner with same knife each coat with no paper tears, What the hell are you on? Are you Brook Lesner pumped up on roids


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## gordie (Nov 6, 2012)

Poor brook Lesnar and his roids. I wish I could get roids from my doc like sly Stallone does I'd be flexing my new 16 in arms and telling anyone that would listen that I suffer every day from low test and they should feal bad for me and my sad situation lol


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Lol... im no Brock lesner but I've been working harder than I need to at drywall a long time, **** we still hang 5/8 12s type x on ceilings by hand up my way.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

Im pretty rough on it... you can scream on metal ounce its hung and preped.... ive sliced paper a few times, mostly on that stupid hydro bead chit... man Do I hate that stuff.


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## Krsw85 (Jul 20, 2016)

It happens to me on the no coat too.... just so used to metal where you can just fly and not worry about it... and I try to be cateful with paper but I get all the crazy jobs a box store they want framed hung taped and painted in 7 days with 200 sheets and 4 guys... its always a rush, so I spend the majority of my time behing crappy hangers doing prep work, the last ome was 150 sheets with about 500 ft of zip bead. I was 2 days prepping the damn place... I hang about 100 ft of bead per hour and its a 5 hour job for just tje zip bead (tear away L)


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

No coat on the Centre can tear up. You need to be careful. I wonder if I thin it down it might flow easier and I won't need to push so hard.

Lol. Just having a dig mate. No harm intended ok.


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1061155130598396&id=172599606120624


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1172663852801324&substory_index=0&id=100001731606717


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