# adding glue



## lrees

1. I will be using green bucket all purpose taping joints with paper on this job coming up soon.... Taping only compounds are not available in my area. maybe i don't need to add glue to all purpose?.. If I do how much per bucket? And what glue could i use that i can find in my area?? (we have no mud max or glue like that.)


2. Another question?? On a past job i did. where the three way corners met and where factory joints ran into the inside corners, i had a few hair line cracks? im thinkin it was from maybe not a 100% dry when it got second coated? or ccould it be from something else.. it was a garage. cold weather outside. was 60 degrees in the garage when it got finished.


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## fr8train

Cold air infiltrating the structure and getting to the back of the mud can/will cause cracks.

Shouldn't need to add glue to green lid compound. But you can if you want.

Were the cracks in the mud, or in the tape? Big difference! On our angles, I see a lot of hairline cracks, right in the corner. These are in the mud and sand out with a swipe of a sponge.


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## lrees

fr8train said:


> Cold air infiltrating the structure and getting to the back of the mud can/will cause cracks.
> 
> Shouldn't need to add glue to green lid compound. But you can if you want.
> 
> Were the cracks in the mud, or in the tape? Big difference! On our angles, I see a lot of hairline cracks, right in the corner. These are in the mud and sand out with a swipe of a sponge.


Im not sure but want to say in the mud. Could that also be from being wet in between coats?


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## lrees

lrees said:


> Im not sure but want to say in the mud. Could that also be from being wet in between coats?


If it is in the tape how could you tell?


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## lrees

fr8train said:


> Cold air infiltrating the structure and getting to the back of the mud can/will cause cracks.
> 
> Shouldn't need to add glue to green lid compound. But you can if you want.
> 
> Were the cracks in the mud, or in the tape? Big difference! On our angles, I see a lot of hairline cracks, right in the corner. These are in the mud and sand out with a swipe of a sponge.


If it is in the tape how could u tell?


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## icerock drywall

lrees said:


> 1. I will be using green bucket all purpose taping joints with paper on this job coming up soon.... Taping only compounds are not available in my area. maybe i don't need to add glue to all purpose?.. If I do how much per bucket? And what glue could i use that i can find in my area?? (we have no mud max or glue like that.)
> 
> 
> 2. Another question?? On a past job i did. where the three way corners met and where factory joints ran into the inside corners, i had a few hair line cracks? im thinkin it was from maybe not a 100% dry when it got second coated? or ccould it be from something else.. it was a garage. cold weather outside. was 60 degrees in the garage when it got finished.


if you add a lot of h2o in your mud the glue should be added ...less h2o and add glue. the out side corners add glue to mud and less mud on your 3 ways. too much mud in the corner it will look like a crack. its not the tape.


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## lrees

icerock drywall said:


> if you add a lot of h2o in your mud the glue should be added ...less h2o and add glue. the out side corners add glue to mud and less mud on your 3 ways. too much mud in the corner it will look like a crack. its not the tape.


So when I add water to mud so I can run through bazooka.. I need to add glue? Elmers glue ha? How much?


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## moore

I really don't see why any glue should be added to a A/P compound .
There's glue in the mud..If the mud is watered down The glue's still there.

I piss down my angle mud for tape....And that's one part of the tape coat I see fail hardly ever.


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## Bazooka-Joe

moore said:


> I really don't see why any glue should be added to a A/P compound .
> There's glue in the mud..If the mud is watered down The glue's still there.
> 
> I piss down my angle mud for tape....And that's one part of the tape coat I see fail hardly ever.


thought AP had no glue just factory reject mud, never had cracks in Angles have always used glue mud.

a quarter to a







half cup of white glue
to a box of AP
works


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## fr8train

Where do you hear that Joe?


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## boco

I like to add a bit of glue for my angles. Thin down the mudd and add some woodglue. Half a cup is plenty. If your hands are tacky after using then you know you have added enough. I think it does help with speed and the amount of wiping needed.


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## Bazooka-Joe

fr8train said:


> Where do you hear that Joe?


seen a how its made video, I had a few stinky







batches also


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## fr8train

Did not know that, I watched that show, just didn't see that episode


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> I really don't see why any glue should be added to a A/P compound .
> There's glue in the mud..If the mud is watered down The glue's still there.
> 
> I piss down my angle mud for tape....And that's one part of the tape coat I see fail hardly ever.


some tapers use too much h2o in there mud...witch dilutes the mud and makes the mud to weak and then the tape don't stick to the drywall. most of the tapers that use the zook needs the mud thin and I have done a ton of repair because the tape can peel off the walls and just falls off in basements and in the garage. that why the good tapers like 2 bucksheeparoo will use glue on the tape coat with ap.
banjo users...the mud is a little thicker but it will not hurt to add a little glue to the mud if you use paper tape.
hand tapers just need to mix the mud and add very little h2o so no glue needed ...but I like dawn


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## icerock drywall

going to do a little test and try this in my mud 
http://www.thepaintstore.com/Flood_Floetrol_Latex_Paint_Additive_p/610.htm
on my 2nd coat. has anyone done this?


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## mld

Used Floetrol in paint before, but what are you trying to accomplish by adding it to mud?:icon_confused:


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## icerock drywall

mld said:


> Used Floetrol in paint before, but what are you trying to accomplish by adding it to mud?:icon_confused:


the same thing dawn dose...makes it smooth with no air bubbles ...I don't know why I want to try it ...I do crazy things sometimes


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## bmitch

icerock drywall said:


> some tapers use too much h2o in there mud...witch dilutes the mud and makes the mud to weak and then the tape don't stick to the drywall. most of the tapers that use the zook needs the mud thin and I have done a ton of repair because the tape can peel off the walls and just falls off in basements and in the garage. that why the good tapers like 2 bucksheeparoo will use glue on the tape coat with ap.
> banjo users...the mud is a little thicker but it will not hurt to add a little glue to the mud if you use paper tape.
> hand tapers just need to mix the mud and add very little h2o so no glue needed ...but I like dawn


I really don't get this.
add glue for first coat on beads,add glue to run tapes.what kind of mud are you people running that you think it's nessesary to be adding glue to all of it.glues not the answer to end all.maybe you should be looking to make a product change.


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## icerock drywall

b said:


> I really don't get this.
> add glue for first coat on beads,add glue to run tapes.what kind of mud are you people running that you think it's nessesary to be adding glue to all of it.glues not the answer to end all.maybe you should be looking to make a product change.


jobs that a have to fix are tapers that use mesh and tapers that use the zook ...if they add to much water to the mud ap or light or anything besides durabond I can peel the tape off the drywall ...if glue is added the tape is fine


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## bmitch

truth is ice,you're repairs are behind wanna be tapers.


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## boco

I have no problems with the USG green top. Actually its what I started using 20 some odd years ago. I have tried most other brands but always go back to the old school stuff. As for my bead I am almost 100% muddset. I use the blue or green lid and add muddmaxx. Its definately helps with adhesion and does seem to harden up the mud abit. For angles I use a corner roller and thin down my mudd some so muddmax helps for a quick wrinkle free tape install. I think the reason i was having some trouble was due to the frigid temperatures and temp heat on 50 year old concrete slabs. Once I added a bit of glue the wrinkling went away.


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## Mountain Man

I don't even want to get into this one but here goes. I run AP through my bazooka and ya I thin it down pretty good especially for angles. But guess what? USG green top AP sticks like a mofo, I challenge you to come pull it off. I don't and will never tape with hot mud or durabond. I'm involved in production drywall finishing and I make my money with the tools, especially the bazooka. There's nothing wrong with using glue but to say that you need to put glue in all AP is a pretty generalized statement.


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## icerock drywall

b said:


> truth is ice,you're repairs are behind wanna be tapers.


never thought about that:thumbsup:


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## icerock drywall

Mountain Man said:


> I don't even want to get into this one but here goes. I run AP through my bazooka and ya I thin it down pretty good especially for angles. But guess what? USG green top AP sticks like a mofo, I challenge you to come pull it off. I don't and will never tape with hot mud or durabond. I'm involved in production drywall finishing and I make my money with the tools, especially the bazooka. There's nothing wrong with using glue but to say that you need to put glue in all AP is a pretty generalized statement.


if I went to one of your jobs I would pull your tape off ...I would start in the garage. then you would be mad at me. this is what I would do. one slice on the seam than a pull the tape ,off it comes then it would hit butt pulling the tape off the butt ,then it would run in the corner ..o no then I would pull the corner off the walls....well I hope I am not right but around here the tapers must suck because I go to some jobs and I don't even need to cut it. I just pull the tape with my fingers. witch brings me to another point fire code drywall in the garage ??? why not OSB with fire paint!


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## moore

I would love to try what you yanks call taping mud. Just from the pics I can see It's loaded with glue . I'm guessing That's the only diff . Between Your standard A/P and taping mud The T/M has just a bit more glue in it?

I will add a little glue to hotmud when doing patches over paint..Seems to cut the pocs and bubbles down a little ...but not much.. 
You know hot muds are labeled as an A/P Compound ! BUT..There not. and L/W muds are labeled as an A/P Compound ! But ..There not. 
Just thought I'd throw that out there!

The L/W muds plus 3 /rapid coat/lime lid sheetrock...Are all L/W muds with the least amount of glue to them..I would guess that's why there so easy to sand. And why most tapers only use them on the skim coat. 

As much as I hate to admit he's right! :drink: Of all the bucket muds Iv'e had hands to... the Ruco has A ton of glue to it! More so than N/G or USG. and the shrinkage is just right!! But It rolls up and It's a gummy mix to deal with . [i can live with that].


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## moore

Mountain Man said:


> I don't even want to get into this one but here goes. I run AP through my bazooka and ya I thin it down pretty good especially for angles. But guess what? USG green top AP sticks like a mofo, I challenge you to come pull it off. I don't and will never tape with hot mud or durabond. I'm involved in production drywall finishing and I make my money with the tools, especially the bazooka. There's nothing wrong with using glue but to say that you need to put glue in all AP is a pretty generalized statement.


I will only tape my seams and butt joints with hot mud year round..Been doing it for the last 15 years .


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> if I went to one of your jobs I would pull your tape off ...I would start in the garage. then you would be mad at me. this is what I would do. one slice on the seam than a pull the tape ,off it comes then it would hit butt pulling the tape off the butt ,then it would run in the corner ..


In a Garage with no [email protected] There's no need to tug at It !! Just sit around and wait...It'll fall off on it's own!:thumbup:


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> In a Garage with no [email protected] There's no need to tug at It !! Just sit around and wait...It'll fall off on it's own!:thumbup:


lol...and will it fall off with mudmax? and like I said why cant the fire code change to osb with fire paint? what do you think moore


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> what do you think moore


I know that plaster will last And drywall is just a band-aid If any drywaller tells you different he's lying.


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## 2buckcanuck

b said:


> I really don't get this.
> add glue for first coat on beads,add glue to run tapes.what kind of mud are you people running that you think it's nessesary to be adding glue to all of it.glues not the answer to end all.maybe you should be looking to make a product change.


Well, since your from Ontario, along with Mudslingr who thanked you, I'm curious as to which muds you guys use:whistling2:

Try this one day, Lets talk CGC mud. if you have a box of green, red, and machine mud. take stiff mud right out of the box, stick some scrap tapes onto a scrap piece of drywall, then try pulling them off the next day,,,, I will tell you one thing, if you use machine mud to tape with, your going to Chit in your pants when you see how easy that tape pulls off compared to the other two muds.

Also, have you ever bought a tube of white glue, and said"I'm going to add water to it to make it stronger!",,,I doubt it

Mud is a glue,,PERIOD,,, and each brand or type (taping mud, all purpose and light weight) have different amounts of glue in them,,,,period


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## bmitch

welcome back.whats the point your trying to take with this.i run my tapes with certainteed taping {yellow box},coat out with certainteed one allpurpose.i'm not a hand taper and never have been.if I ever had tapes letting go because of my methods of application I'd definetly be making a product change and it won't be to add more glue.


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## Bazooka-Joe

fellas please listen yeller box has glue, the other has no glue,:whistling2:


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## moore

Bazooka-Joe said:


> fellas please listen yeller box has glue, the other has no glue,:whistling2:


What's the other?


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## fr8train

I'm assuming the certainteed one a/p


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## boco

I just found out that a local store has some USG taping mudd on hand. . Glidden now owned by PPG just started carrying USG Taping, midweight, dustless, and light geen compounds. I will give it a try in a few weeks from now when I start taping again. Also got a new tube and angle flushers from all wall. Hopefully I can get some good results with both.


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## Bazooka-Joe

moore said:


> What's the other?


AP and Toppings


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## chris

The only reason we add glue is because our favorite mud doesnot have what I feel is enough. We add glue to our cornerbeads and our prefill mud. We use a taping mud for paper tape. Taping mud is just a AP with more glue . You dont want to finish with it, just tape . We also stick our inside open angles with it too.Taping mud ( and mean green ) are only used as a base coat , we like to finish with the lite ap.


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## thefinisher

moore said:


> I would love to try what you yanks call taping mud. Just from the pics I can see It's loaded with glue . I'm guessing That's the only diff . Between Your standard A/P and taping mud The T/M has just a bit more glue in it?
> 
> I will add a little glue to hotmud when doing patches over paint..Seems to cut the pocs and bubbles down a little ...but not much..
> You know hot muds are labeled as an A/P Compound ! BUT..There not. and L/W muds are labeled as an A/P Compound ! But ..There not.
> Just thought I'd throw that out there!
> 
> The L/W muds plus 3 /rapid coat/lime lid sheetrock...Are all L/W muds with the least amount of glue to them..I would guess that's why there so easy to sand. And why most tapers only use them on the skim coat.
> 
> As much as I hate to admit he's right! :drink: Of all the bucket muds Iv'e had hands to... the Ruco has A ton of glue to it! More so than N/G or USG. and the shrinkage is just right!! But It rolls up and It's a gummy mix to deal with . [i can live with that].


Thats right Moore, come to the Ruco dark side . Although we have stocked a few houses with proform black lid recently as well.


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## mudslingr

2buckcanuck said:


> Well, since your from Ontario, along with Mudslingr who thanked you, I'm curious as to which muds you guys use:whistling2:
> 
> Try this one day, Lets talk CGC mud. if you have a box of green, red, and machine mud. take stiff mud right out of the box, stick some scrap tapes onto a scrap piece of drywall, then try pulling them off the next day,,,, I will tell you one thing, if you use machine mud to tape with, your going to Chit in your pants when you see how easy that tape pulls off compared to the other two muds.
> 
> Also, have you ever bought a tube of white glue, and said"I'm going to add water to it to make it stronger!",,,I doubt it
> 
> Mud is a glue,,PERIOD,,, and each brand or type (taping mud, all purpose and light weight) have different amounts of glue in them,,,,period


What i surmised from Bernie's post is that he is inferring that we really shouldn't have to add glue for taping with a/p. I use Certainteed as well,Synko and occasionally some USG or some other crap from the States.
There was a time when we had no "taping mud" and we used the a/p for everything. It worked then and still works now. If not, I'm going to be real busy in the future with the couple thousand call backs I'm about to get.:no: 

Personally, I only use the yellow because I like how it shrinks in the flats and angles.:thumbsup:


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## icerock drywall

mudslingr said:


> What i surmised from Bernie's post is that he is inferring that we really shouldn't have to add glue for taping with a/p. I use Certainteed as well,Synko and occasionally some USG or some other crap from the States.
> There was a time when we had no "taping mud" and we used the a/p for everything. It worked then and still works now. If not, I'm going to be real busy in the future with the couple thousand call backs I'm about to get.:no:
> 
> Personally, I only use the yellow because I like how it shrinks in the flats and angles.:thumbsup:


 no you will not be busy at all...they will not call you back. they will call someone like me to fix it.:thumbup:


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## mudslingr

Nah, I'll be ok Icepick. We have very good mud here and I know how to use it. You won't make a buck off me !


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## icerock drywall

mudslingr said:


> Nah, I'll be ok Icepick. We have very good mud here and I know how to use it. You won't make a buck off me !


LMAO...I was just trying to get you going...your to good of a person not to give me a slam back.:thumbsup:


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## bmitch

icerock drywall said:


> no you will not be busy at all...they will not call you back. they will call someone like me to fix it.:thumbup:


that's funny ice,but what would be even funnier would be to watch you or anyone else trying to remove tapes that I've run .without adding additional glue.:jester:


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## thefinisher

If you want ap with added glue then order a pallet of Ruco AP. Would have an easier time baptizing a cat than pulling off those tapes. It is very slick, heavy, and stinks of glue. We use it for all phases and our Sanders hate us


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## moore

thefinisher said:


> If you want ap with added glue then order a pallet of Ruco AP. Would have an easier time baptizing a cat than pulling off those tapes. It is very slick, heavy, and stinks of glue. We use it for all phases and our Sanders hate us


Yes...When you open the bucket The shine hits you In the face,:yes:,,Kinda like what black top use to be.But ain't no more!!..


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## moore

thefinisher said:


> Would have an easier time baptizing a cat


LOL!!! Never heard that one before!!! :laughing:


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## icerock drywall

had to pull more paper tape from corners from another job...
after cleaning out the corner I tried something new in the corners
tt with ez sand 20 with mud max on my 1st coat


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## endo_alley

We sometimes use a product called Admix to our mud as an adhesive and strengthener. It is an acrylic additive used in a lot of cement products like eifs basecoat or thinset. Not very sandable when dry.


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## lrees

boco said:


> I have no problems with the USG green top. Actually its what I started using 20 some odd years ago. I have tried most other brands but always go back to the old school stuff. As for my bead I am almost 100% muddset. I use the blue or green lid and add muddmaxx. Its definately helps with adhesion and does seem to harden up the mud abit. For angles I use a corner roller and thin down my mudd some so muddmax helps for a quick wrinkle free tape install. I think the reason i was having some trouble was due to the frigid temperatures and temp heat on 50 year old concrete slabs. Once I added a bit of glue the wrinkling went away.


I have a few metal beads to coat this week. I need to choose between green lid a/p or e z sand 45 for first coat. Wandering which way to go? and if there is one that is better to use, is it by a lot or just a little.. thanks


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## moore

lrees said:


> I have a few metal beads to coat this week. I need to choose between green lid a/p or e z sand 45 for first coat. Wandering which way to go? and if there is one that is better to use, is it by a lot or just a little.. thanks


Hot mud will not stick to metal. Try it...Then give the flange a good tap after the hot mud is cure...It will pop off!


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> Hot mud will not stick to metal. Try it...Then give the flange a good tap after the hot mud is cure...It will pop off!


you want some moore of that:thumbup:


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## drywallninja

There was a time when we had no "taping mud" and we used the a/p for everything. It worked then and still works now. If not, I'm going to be real busy in the future with the couple thousand call backs I'm about to get.:

Couldn't agree more. I think all you glue addicts are on glue!


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## fr8train

I wouldn't go out if my way to add glue to all of my mud, but IF I had to do a metal bead repair, AND it had to be done with hot mud, I would add glue or mudmax if I had it.


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## lrees

fr8train said:


> I wouldn't go out if my way to add glue to all of my mud, but IF I had to do a metal bead repair, AND it had to be done with hot mud, I would add glue or mudmax if I had it.[/QUOT
> 
> Looks like ill be using the a/p on the metal bead


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## mld

You have chosen wisely, grasshopper.:thumbsup:

Lol!


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## boco

Gosh darn it. I forgot to use taping mudd on the house we strung out yesterday. Totally forgot but really wanted to try it. This house has 12 sticks of metal bead total. Its snowing like a Mfuucker and it was on site. I threw in 2 cups of ez sand 45 into a bucket of green top usg. Didnt have any glue but I think its a good way to coat metal. Basicall needs a few touch ups from some chunks and another coat and it will be ready to sand. Adding to ez sand reduces shrinking and improves the dry time quite abit.


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## lrees

boco said:


> Gosh darn it. I forgot to use taping mudd on the house we strung out yesterday. Totally forgot but really wanted to try it. This house has 12 sticks of metal bead total. Its snowing like a Mfuucker and it was on site. I threw in 2 cups of ez sand 45 into a bucket of green top usg. Didnt have any glue but I think its a good way to coat metal. Basicall needs a few touch ups from some chunks and another coat and it will be ready to sand. Adding to ez sand reduces shrinking and improves the dry time quite abit.


I had a air bubble behind tape. On my 10 Inch swipe.. I cut it out ... it ended up not being cut all the way. I prolly could have pulled all the tape off if I wanted.. would the tape pull off because that coat had been put on and just the moisture or why is that? Or am I doing something wrong?


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## chris

Sounds like it just came off because the joint was wet. When you coat a seam that is already dry, after a minute the whole thing is basically wet again. When seams are wet tape is easy to pull off.


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## icerock drywall

another week another job ripping more tape off.... o well


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> another week another job ripping more tape off.... o well


It didn't crack!:whistling2:


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> It didn't crack!:whistling2:


no...just air spots here and there so I just pulled it all off and ff it:thumbsup:


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## lrees

chris said:


> Sounds like it just came off because the joint was wet. When you coat a seam that is already dry, after a minute the whole thing is basically wet again. When seams are wet tape is easy to pull off.


I did see green lid a/p cracked like a mofo on metal beads as it dried


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## Philma Crevices

Glue mud like green will crackle if applied heavy, but it doesn't necessarily mean the joint or whatever is bad, sand and recoat will polish it up


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> another week another job ripping more tape off.... o well


I made a vid for you today Ice Man! But I left my damn camera on the job! I'll upload It tomorrow night. Your gonna hate it.:whistling2:


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## drywallninja

moore said:


> I made a vid for you today Ice Man! But I left my damn camera on the job! I'll upload It tomorrow night. Your gonna hate it.:whistling2:


Bet I already know what that video entails!


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> I made a vid for you today Ice Man! But I left my damn camera on the job! I'll upload It tomorrow night. Your gonna hate it.:whistling2:


is she hot go back to work I want to see it....!!!!!


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> is she hot go back to work I want to see it....!!!!!


Hot has something to do with It.


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## icerock drywall

:whistling2:


moore said:


> Hot has something to do with It.


o my god hot glue and tape


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## lrees

icerock drywall said:


> :whistling2:
> 
> o my god hot glue and tape


Off topic but cant figure out how to start a new thread off phone.... a level 4 four does not reqiure a primer? .....(justvrecommended if im right)... im not a painter but if I do a level 3 and painter primes and two coats of finish is that considered level 5 then since they primed first?


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## boco

No. Level 5 you need to skim coat entire wall. The other option is to spray a level 5 surfacer primer. The surfacer works but its expensive and a large sprayer preferrably air assisted is needed.


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## fr8train

Generally speaking, a proper level 5 should have a pert near perfect level 4 underneath of it, otherwise it's pointless.


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## moore

fr8train said:


> Generally speaking, a proper level 5 should have a pert near perfect level 4 underneath of it, otherwise it's pointless.


But ....If it gets sprayed down with a water hose ? Why bother going level 1? :blink:


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> But ....If it gets sprayed down with a water hose ? Why bother going level 1? :blink:


I like doing a nice smooth job and then they save money and paint it...roller lines :furious:


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## fr8train

moore said:


> But ....If it gets sprayed down with a water hose ? Why bother going level 1? :blink:


Isn't that why you use hot mud?


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## lrees

boco said:


> No. Level 5 you need to skim coat entire wall. The other option is to spray a level 5 surfacer primer. The surfacer works but its expensive and a large sprayer preferrably air assisted is needed.


Im workin on a job. It requires level 4. And gc was tellin us we need to cover everything with primer?


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> is she hot go back to work I want to see it....!!!!!


Ruco 90 min tape coat . Black top A/P block coat. Heat pump running at 70. Tape coat was cure and block coat also. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4NxrhghDw0&feature=youtu.be


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> Ruco 90 min tape coat . Black top A/P block coat. Heat pump running at 70. Tape coat was cure and block coat also.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4NxrhghDw0&feature=youtu.be


I did not see any hot chicks :furious:


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## Mr.Brightstar

moore said:


> Ruco 90 min tape coat . Black top A/P block coat. Heat pump running at 70. Tape coat was cure and block coat also. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4NxrhghDw0&feature=youtu.be


 that tape seems to be sticking on the wall very well. Did you add glue?


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## icerock drywall

Mr.Brightstar said:


> that tape seems to be sticking on the wall very well. Did you add glue?


I think not


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## moore

Tape coat with blacktop A/P. Block coat with Black top A/P.
The tape sat for two days with heat . The block coat sat for one day with heat....[heat pump 70 degrees] 


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3G-esEJLXU&feature=youtu.be


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> I think not


OH!!!!!! I forgot to add....I did not add glue. :thumbsup:


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## Mr.Brightstar

Why were you Tearing it off?


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> Tape coat with blacktop A/P. Block coat with Black top A/P.
> The tape sat for two days with heat . The block coat sat for one day with heat....[heat pump 70 degrees]
> 
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3G-esEJLXU&feature=youtu.be


do the same test with ff:thumbup:


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## icerock drywall

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Why were you Tearing it off?


because moore did not want me to see him


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## Mr.Brightstar

icerock drywall said:


> do the same test with ff:thumbup:


 I think Mesh would tear off easier.


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> OH!!!!!! I forgot to add....I did not add glue. :thumbsup:


I do like black led ap mud ....only if moore finishers would use it:yesn there tape coat...but you did not use a zook ......the zookers add more h20 then you Mr Moore


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## Mr.Brightstar

icerock drywall said:


> because moore did not want me to see him


 looks like he got the go Pro camera.


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## icerock drywall

Mr.Brightstar said:


> I think Mesh would tear off easier.


you said the M word:whistling2:


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## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Why were you Tearing it off?


I Told the hangers to hang the fire place . Then the g/c said he wanted it dura rocked and stoned.. I Had to tear the board down.. So I taped the basement stairwell with A/P[ which is against my Religion ] I wanted to see myself which was a stronger tape coat. Not that I didn't have a good idea..


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## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> that tape seems to be sticking on the wall very well. Did you add glue?


No glue added..


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> do the same test with ff:thumbup:


Tomorrow! FF applied with A/P With a block coat over top. Been dried/cured for three days..


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> I do like black led ap mud ....only if moore finishers would use it:yesn there tape coat...but you did not use a zook ......the zookers add more h20 then you Mr Moore


They add no more water to the taping mud than I add to the hot mud. In fact they probably add less!:yes:


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> They add no more water to the taping mud than I add to the hot mud. In fact they probably add less!:yes:


 how did you do this test...what where the steps and how wet is your mud dose it slip off your knife...I want to know more


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> how did you do this test...what where the steps and how wet is your mud dose it slip off your knife...I want to know more


I didn't plan on this at all ice...The G/C asked me to pull a few sheets down.
After seeing how tight the tape held with H/M ..I took a vid for you.

Then taped a few flats in the stairwell with A/P for comparison .. Which led me to tape a few repairs with mesh and A/P ..I'll see how the mesh holds up tomorrow.


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## thefinisher

Moore are you taping with actual durabond or quickset sandable stuff?


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## moore

thefinisher said:


> Moore are you taping with actual durabond or quickset sandable stuff?


Ruco 90 . [Green or blue bag] Any hot mud In general will do for me.


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## moore

icerock drywall said:


> do the same test with ff:thumbup:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6njPY2RYW4A&feature=youtu.be


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## fr8train

So.... is that a plus or a negative?


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## moore

fr8train said:


> So.... is that a plus or a negative?


I Like FF!!! I had a few peter butts crack on me using the FF ,,,But I'm still green with It!!!! I may have wiped them too tight.. The thing I noticed most about FF is it swells ! hot mud or A/P It swells /expands when wet .


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## fr8train

I noticed with FF it's a very light hand with the wiping, there is an adjustment. But dang it was nice!


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## icerock drywall

moore said:


> I Like FF!!! I had a few peter butts crack on me using the FF ,,,But I'm still green with It!!!! I may have wiped them too tight.. The thing I noticed most about FF is it swells ! hot mud or A/P It swells /expands when wet .


try not to put the middle of the tape on the butt crack...offset it


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## fr8train

icerock drywall said:


> try not to put the middle of the tape on the butt crack...offset it


Lol, you said butt crack.


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## Kiwiman

moore said:


> I Like FF!!! I had a few peter butts crack on me using the FF ,,,But I'm still green with It!!!! I may have wiped them too tight.. The thing I noticed most about FF is it swells ! hot mud or A/P It swells /expands when wet .


I slice the sharp edge off the butts, it helps stop it cutting through the fuse if wiped too hard. If it tends to swell when patching holes, try wiping it dry without putting more mud over it until after it sets.
After watching your vid when you said no glue in it, it got me to thinking.... with paper it is glued to the board, with fuse it's not so much glued to the board rather it becomes part of the mud, therefore my hypothesis is.....:whistling2: You could use any mud, glue or no glue with fibafuse .....I think I've been listening to Slim and Justme too long


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## Bazooka-Joe

Kiwiman said:


> I slice the sharp edge off the butts, it helps stop it cutting through the fuse if wiped too hard. If it tends to swell when patching holes, try wiping it dry without putting more mud over it until after it sets.
> After watching your vid when you said no glue in it, it got me to thinking.... with paper it is glued to the board, with fuse it's not so much glued to the board rather it becomes part of the mud, therefore my hypothesis is.....:whistling2: You could use any mud, glue or no glue with fibafuse .....I think I've been listening to Slim and Justme too long



I say sir I think you bumped your head









no glue or hotmud no tape noway next your changen your name to quikie


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## icerock drywall

Bazooka-Joe said:


> I say sir I think you bumped your head
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no glue or hotmud no tape noway next your changen your name to quikie


hmmm no tape . o ya . I have some garage work in testing with no tape:yes: just flats and one year no cracks


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## D A Drywall

No tape? I got called to finish a home owner hang job where the owner started filling taper joints and butts without tape. Thankfully he didn't get far before he got discouraged cause within 3 months it was all cracked. PC helped me clean up the butts but I had to pole the mud out of the tapers to start fresh. Love those hourly jobs where they tell you do what you gotta do to make it right.


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## gazman

Bazooka-Joe said:


> I say sir I think you bumped your head
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> no glue or hotmud no tape noway next your changen your name to quikie



Have another read Joe, at no time did Kiwiman say no tape.


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## Kiwiman

Thanks Gaz, I was going to make the same comment but wasn't sure if BJ meant he wouldn't tape a job if he had no glue.
Just to clarify, why is there glue in mud? is it just to adhere the papertape to the board or does it help glue the sheets together and make a stronger joint. I'm guessing there would be no need to add glue if using Fibafuse.


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## gazman

Glue appears to act as a hardener as well as a bonder, our AP is harder than topping. So I think I will stick with the AP.


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## cazna

Looks like I have a damaged painted ceiling to level 5 skim, And I have an old bottle of pva glue with about one litre in it, Should I add it to the mud to increase adhesion, or shall I not??

Never added it to mud before, Our muds seem to stick ok but would it help??


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## gazman

If I have to put cornice up where the ceiling has already been painted I always put a coat of Bondcrete on the paint first. ( it is a PVA ) I have seen to many examples of cornice falling down when not using glue. I assume it helps because I have never had a call back with my cornice falling down. So IMO when going over paint PVA is good insurance.


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## VANMAN

gazman said:


> If I have to put cornice up where the ceiling has already been painted I always put a coat of Bondcrete on the paint first. ( it is a PVA ) I have seen to many examples of cornice falling down when not using glue. I assume it helps because I have never had a call back with my cornice falling down. So IMO when going over paint PVA is good insurance.


Ur spot on Gaz!:thumbsup:
I also put it in my fastest when mixing!!!


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## keke

cazna said:


> Looks like I have a damaged painted ceiling to level 5 skim, And I have an old bottle of pva glue with about one litre in it, Should I add it to the mud to increase adhesion, or shall I not??
> 
> Never added it to mud before, Our muds seem to stick ok but would it help??


if you don't wanna have problems like me follow gazman's advice :thumbsup:


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