# Paper Tape over Mesh?



## Saul_Surfaces (Jan 8, 2010)

I recently did some patch work on a factory built home that had been moved to site. It had been taped at the factory with paper directly over mesh. 

Anyone ever see that before? 

The seams were feathered out nice in that there were no humps visible on the butt seams, but there didn't seem to have been enough mud to fill the mesh and bond the paper well. Several had failed from an apparent lack of mud (and the twisting action of the move).


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

guess they should of went mesh over paper then:jester:
guess some engineer thought that would make it stronger for the move,was the mesh tape in bedded with hot mud.
or maybe they started the classic battle of "which is better mesh or paper tape" then they said to hell with it use both
factory workers you know:whistling2:


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## Final touch drywall (Mar 30, 2010)

Mesh will never work with standard pre-mixed mud.period


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

I have seen repairs mesh over paper and paper over mesh. Now we will being seeing FibaFuse over both. Real guys figure out what the actual problem is and address that by either reinstalling correctly, avoiding landing on headers or using some other technique that isolates the drywall from the framing movement.


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## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

Avoid landing on headers? Thats where all butts should land!!!!!!


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

DSJOHN said:


> Avoid landing on headers? Thats where all butts should land!!!!!!


Yeah bud, thats right. If the header gives,,,,,,,

Or///

If the house sinks??

How can we install drywall to prevent poor framing and sinking foundations for causing drywall to crack???? 

We CAN"T. No matter what type of system you use, If the house settles,,, the drywall WILL crack.


THERFORE,,,, we always break our rock over the doors and windows.

Nuff said.


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

If a butt must break at a door, or window, then break it in the middle. I prefer to run a full board over the opening.


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## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

kgphoto said:


> If a butt must break at a door, or window, then break it in the middle. I prefer to run a full board over the opening.


Point proven---youre a carpenter first, taper second,, all drywallers break the butt in the middle of a window or door for more than one reason,,we know them you should too but your carpenter instincts take over first,like the one that put butt joints in skylites cause he needed to use scrap up.


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

DSJOHN said:


> Point proven---youre a carpenter first, taper second,, all drywallers break the butt in the middle of a window or door for more than one reason,,we know them you should too but your carpenter instincts take over first,like the one that put butt joints in skylites cause he needed to use scrap up.


butt joint in a skylite !!!!!! you just confirmed me to be a believer in capital punishment


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## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

For real---the builder did that to me-------I asked him why he didnt 2 piece his stair riser or treads,,,ya know just using scrap!!!!


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Oh tell me about it, I get it often, they use up the scraps becouse they think they are saving money, Huh, costs more for me to fix the mess in hrs and materials than it does to get another sheet, Carpenters can be thick sometimes, on my next house im about to start they found a sheet with a big deep scratch about a metre long and its torn a big peice of paper off it....... so where did they put it.......... right on the ceiling in the middle of the main living area in front of double doors that overlooks the sea......and its in front of the main entrance, these guys are ment to be top builders and have no idea how to hide things like this, this is the norm, and when you explain that if they put this sheet against the wall away from critical light it would and been a better option, you become the annoying drywall guy, Thats my rant.


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

DSJOHN said:


> Point proven---youre a carpenter first, taper second,, all drywallers break the butt in the middle of a window or door for more than one reason,,we know them you should too but your carpenter instincts take over first,like the one that put butt joints in skylites cause he needed to use scrap up.


I would like to hear what your reasons are and see how they differ from what I was taught. No joints at the door openings at all, if we could avoid them. Butts in skylights is just plain silly. You want minimal work up there and avoid all joints due to the raking light.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

kgphoto said:


> I would like to hear what your reasons are and see how they differ from what I was taught. No joints at the door openings at all, if we could avoid them. Butts in skylights is just plain silly. You want minimal work up there and avoid all joints due to the raking light.


 Kirk, just do drywall for a few years, and you'll understand his reasoning


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

Hmm. Don't think that is an accurate statement. I have done it for years, just like you have, just not as my only type of work. We both have "not known something", so obviously time is not the educating factor.


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## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

kgphoto said:


> I would like to hear what your reasons are and see how they differ from what I was taught. No joints at the door openings at all, if we could avoid them. Butts in skylights is just plain silly. You want minimal work up there and avoid all joints due to the raking light.


You were not taught by a drywaller,seriously , I haven,t looked in the USG book for quite sometime,but sure they will tell you that in a long span break joints atleast 8'" ONTO HEADERS . I may be wrong but maybe not? A carpenter will disagree because ,,,,, well,,,,,, because ,,,simply they will,their reason is because they cant trim!!!! [I,ve trimmed tons of windows-so dont go there][biscut joiner-kreg tool-paslode-12" makita slide compound tablesaw-joiner-clamps-18 v makita drill and impact-----I own them all!!!!!]


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

kgphoto said:


> Hmm. Don't think that is an accurate statement. I have done it for years, just like you have, just not as my only type of work. We both have "not known something", so obviously time is not the educating factor.


The fact that you don't think this is an accurate statment, says it ALL Kirk.

You have not done it for years like I have, simply cause I was doing it while you were still in diapers.

Time + observation,,,, IS the educating factor.

Oh wait, I forgot,,, you ONLY want to argue,, right or wrong means nothing to you.


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

not again you guys. c,mon haven't you had this same argument over a different topic like a million times. i'm getting a serious sense of deja-vu.


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Oh just get a room and stop flirting.


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

DSJOHN said:


> You were not taught by a drywaller,seriously , I haven,t looked in the USG book for quite sometime,but sure they will tell you that in a long span break joints atleast 8'" ONTO HEADERS . I may be wrong but maybe not? ]


Yes, you may be wrong. I think if you look it up, you will see that was in reference to not piecing around openings and putting the seams at the corners. If you MUST have a joint at an opening, THEN keep it at least 8 inches onto the header.

Feel free to look it up to confirm.


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## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

Dont misconstrue the facts---- if a wall is 14' and you have 12' rock and there is a door on the right side of the wall,,,, every and I mean EVERY drywaller will hang the sheet full from the left and break it over the door---not the other way [like a carpenter] would---..... THAT SIR IS A FACT!!!!!!!!


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

carpentaper said:


> not again you guys. c,mon haven't you had this same argument over a different topic like a million times. i'm getting a serious sense of deja-vu.


Carpenter, you need to undestand that KGPhoto is a troll. his sole purpose is to start an argument, period. He could care less if he is right or if he is wrong, he just wants to argue. Hence the arguement over a differant topic. 

I for one am out of this arguement


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

DSJOHN said:


> Dont misconstrue the facts---- if a wall is 14' and you have 12' rock and there is a door on the right side of the wall,,,, every and I mean EVERY drywaller will hang the sheet full from the left and break it over the door---not the other way [like a carpenter] would---..... THAT SIR IS A FACT!!!!!!!!


Not misconstruing anything here John. What you posted was an opinion, not a fact. 

None of those details were evident in your first post. It sounds like a perfectly fine way to do it under those circumstances to minimize waste, but change the door position or the room size and it may not be the preferred method.


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> Carpenter, you need to undestand that KGPhoto is a troll. his sole purpose is to start an argument, period. He could care less if he is right or if he is wrong, he just wants to argue. Hence the arguement over a differant topic.
> 
> I for one am out of this arguement


All you have to do is read the posts by the Captain and me to see who starts the arguments, the insults and posts a bunch of garbage. It does frustrate them that I am frequently, not always, right and bring 3rd party and industry standards to support my position. Just like I did with John above.

So the capt. calling me a troll is pretty ironic.


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## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

kgphoto said:


> All you have to do is read the posts by the Captain and me to see who starts the arguments, the insults and posts a bunch of garbage. It does frustrate them that I am frequently, not always, right and bring 3rd party and industry standards to support my position. Just like I did with John above.
> 
> So the capt. calling me a troll is pretty ironic.


What you did was prove you know nothing about drywall ----take a 17' wall with a window in the center,tell me how you would install your sheetrock on this wall and prove to us you,re a drywaller[ there is only 1 answer] and your industry standards b$$$t is just that-----standards as required,,not meaning anything except ---acceptable. Real drywallers install closets in full sheets [not scrap] drop butts on headers[windows and doors] screw in the same pattern, if you want a lesson ,I teach every May at a Voc school!!!!!!


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

DSJOHN said:


> What you did was prove you know nothing about drywall ----take a 17' wall with a window in the center,tell me how you would install your sheetrock on this wall and prove to us you,re a drywaller[ there is only 1 answer] and your industry standards b$$$t is just that-----standards as required,,not meaning anything except ---acceptable. Real drywallers install closets in full sheets [not scrap] drop butts on headers[windows and doors] screw in the same pattern, if you want a lesson ,I teach every May at a Voc school!!!!!!


Do I get to choose my board length or am I just supplied with 2's or 8's? What size is the door?


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

17 foot wall with window in center
you would go 2 eights on top hooked with 1 foot (or so) piece in middle or 2 nines with one joint above window,bottom 2 nines with joint under window,hate it when rocker picture cuts out a window then fires a butt on either side of it. short joints better than 4 ft butts.
think what capt sheet rock is saying... is if god himself (or his son,heard he was a carpenter or something like that) drywalled a house with whatever method,things will crack,sh#t happens.
but never never never cut the rock even with a door or window. guaranteed crack,even the trimmers hate that,
and dsjohn is right from what I read,but if he dis agrees with how I would drywall his 17 ft wall with a window in the center ,well then


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

DSJOHN said:


> What you did was prove you know nothing about drywall ----take a 17' wall with a window in the center,tell me how you would install your sheetrock on this wall and prove to us you,re a drywaller[ there is only 1 answer] and your industry standards b$$$t is just that-----standards as required,,not meaning anything except ---acceptable. Real drywallers install closets in full sheets [not scrap] drop butts on headers[windows and doors] screw in the same pattern, if you want a lesson ,I teach every May at a Voc school!!!!!!


I'd hang a piece around 100" over the top , then use the rest for the bottom piece to break under the window. The second board would hang the other top board, leaving enough to hang in the closet (back wall). then cutting a third board for the other bottom piece, leaving the rest of that board to hang the bottom of the wic. (and enough scrap to hang out the header and legs in that wic).


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

In fact when approching a wall like that, I measure the bottom board first, cut it, then hang the rest over the window. Zero scrap


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## kgphoto (Dec 21, 2009)

Opps, my bad. A window, not a door. What size? Also, am I limited to certain size boards. Still waiting for the answer.


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## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

kgphoto said:


> Opps, my bad. A window, not a door. What size? Also, am I limited to certain size boards. Still waiting for the answer.


You are the drywaller!!!!! You order the house the way you want it!!! The Capt and 2buk answered properly[winners] the butts are broken above and below window[centered ] if possible. If given only 12,s like most jobs,you still hang the same and the leftover is easily used[most times in closet or hallway walls [bottom] next to doors.


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

For those small joints above and below the window, I like making a slight back cut leaves room for more material, Usually just hand tape those , I like saving the tube for the long runs.


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## zack 02 (Aug 27, 2010)

Paper tape is always better i use mesh on outlets small patches but have to use hott mudd always your best answer to prevent cracking


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