# New home construction. Taping



## ryanh (Dec 4, 2009)

Good day.

On new home's when the you tapers work is the homes furance hooked up? especially for people who work in the northern parts.

I'm working on a home, and HVAC refuses to hook up furance (homeowner which has paid for it already has even asked) until after all the sanding is done due to dust getting into the system. He has provided a temp furance that we have hooked up (100amp) but its only got 1 spot it blows and in the 1400sq house does not bring up the temp all through the house. Where we are, on a average winter day outside temps are -20C(-4F) and the mud not drying is a huge concern. Especially in corners in rooms where its an outside corner. Have tried using a propane heater in a room but it just creates alot of moisure and even after drying a corner when the temp drops the bottoms of the corners seem to get wet again.


I'm getting really frustrated and this all could be avoided if the HVAC was [email protected]


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## D's (Jan 15, 2009)

You can pretty much count on the mechanical guys not wanting to fire anything up these days to protect their warranty. You can sometimes convince them to wire it up if you promise to only have it on at night once all the dust has settled. Propane heaters create a nice working temperature but do nothing to help drying. You can rent/buy 240V electric heaters that plug into oven and dryer receptacles and they work great especially if their on long extensions for moving around. I always put it in my quote that the builder is to supply heat - I'd supply but I don't want the potential liability of anything catching fire.

Good luck,
D'S


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2008)

Gotta crack the windows when running temp heat. We have all this on another thread here, but the propane or kero/deisel temp heaters simply will not dry a house if you shut al the windows tight. Open them wide several times daily, you can see a fog exit carrying the moisture once the fog subsides, close it back up, leaving them cracked an inch or so, even at night. Otherwise the next day, it'll be a hot swamp inside and nothing is dry. Dehumidifiers also help, but are costly.

And yep, the builder pays for the temp heat. Oh yeah, your HVAC guy is a woosy.


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## joepro0000 (Jun 14, 2008)

tell them your going to sand with a PC hooked up to a vacuum, and your going to mask off all ac vents, and turn off the furnace the day of sanding. The best solution for drying mud is - WIND! The more wind the faster it drys.


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## rhardman (Jul 7, 2009)

julies said:


> Great work you have done. You can try this 5pc electrical tape for binding. It will not affect your objects and you will get more life.


Alright, who's taping their job with electrical tape????
KG...is that you???:blink:


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## McDusty (Oct 12, 2009)

almost never is the furnace hooked up before I sand. the contractor supplies the box heaters and they are hooked up to the dryer outlet & oven outlet. that and a huge fan dries out almost any house overnight.


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## ryanh (Dec 4, 2009)

Ya I have a Construction heater. But they we have directly hooked to the panel doesn't really push air around all the corners into the backrooms and closets. I picked up some spare heaters.

Ya i made the mistake of blasting my propane heater with the windows cracked, it was like a swamp in there, opened the front door and it looked like a fire with all the moisure exit LOL


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## [email protected] (Dec 23, 2008)

Thing is, they'll need the heat for the painter and trim etc anyways. Why not put it on as soon as we hang it( and get attic blown). Sure there's dust, call the whambulance for the HVAC guy and turn on the friggin heat.


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## taper71 (Dec 9, 2007)

I have the furnaces running in all the homes I tape . The builders I work for just want the job done and with the furnace running it gets done . Construction heaters work ok if you got a long enough cord to have 1 on both floors , but if the home were to burn down insurance would not cover it. 
I personally take on more work when no furnace is hooked up because I will not waste my time going back everyday on a chance that it will be dry... with a furnace running it is dry.
I will not work in homes with propane, gas or natural gas heaters. there is not enough ventilation for the fumes that it produces period ask your local OH & S it is a major safety issue .


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## wnybassman (May 9, 2008)

It used to be common practice around here to let the house "cook" for a week straight with the permanent heat source, mainly to dry out lumber that may have got wet during the building process. During that time, it was also good to get the drywall in the house to let it acclimate to the temperature.

It is not so common practice anymore. Temp heat, opening windows to flush moisture and high velocity fans are common practice now.


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## PrairrieDogExpress (Jan 29, 2010)

I'm in Wpg as well. Only one builder that we work for connects furnace before we are in and the only reason he does is to save on heating cost. My guess is that you started taping that house one or 2 days after the attic was insulated and the temp heat turned on? I know its not always possible but ideally in a house that size you need at least 2 or three days of 220v construction heaters (that are still working well) to really dry things out before starting. I've had alot of guys not allow me to crack windows when the temp dips because of thick ice forming and blocking windows from closing afterward. Just one of the joys of the north! 
Always a tendency for problems down the road when humidity is that high.


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## Wallers (Dec 7, 2008)

WTF? Don't furnaces elsewhere take a filter? Here the contractor comes by, sometimes twice, and changes filters as we are finishing new homes. Some contractors use those gay yellow vent covers, but they usually "accidentally" get knocked off because we don't get much air flow through them. And as wnybassman also said, the smarter builders around here will let the furnace run for a week before they will let us start. That is the best practice.


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## mudslingercor (Jul 2, 2009)

The builder supplies heat ( proper heat ) It's not your job to get the HVAC guy to do anything. That is how trade fights start. Same with water if it isn't hooked up and you have to haul it per bucket charge. If they don't comply them tell them you'll rent buy heaters and supply for $$. House's should be at temp and stay at temp. Don't forget the words " VOID warranty " tends to work well to get your point across. I myself use fans as well as proper heat. NOT using proper heat also voids mud manufactures warranty...That's more ammo. In a Canadian winter when temps really drop it is also very important to have the ceilings insulated before taping. Moisture get caught between drywall and vapor barrier freezes then tapes may even freeze. Also when they finally insulate...well have you ever seen it rain indoor.. not cool.


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## Whitey97 (Jan 27, 2009)

usually in my parts they have paper over the vents, pull a few back. Try using a fan to push air up. It's a sucky situation, but it's what we're given. You just have to make it work.


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## Wallers (Dec 7, 2008)

ryanh said:


> Have tried using a propane heater in a room but it just creates alot of moisure and even after drying a corner when the temp drops the bottoms of the corners seem to get wet again.
> @



When you see this I am assuming its always on exterior walls? That's because the mud was frozen. It looks dry, but then thaws eventually. Explain that to the builder. Also, we leave a couple of windows cracked overnight to let the moisture escape, and use alot of fans to move the heat to where we need it. 

And if the house (lid) is not insulated, REFUSE to start. Temp heat can be managed, but if it's not insulated you are looking at alot of trouble in the future, when the mud thaws and cracks, and the glue separates, and then it dries. funfun!


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## Whitey97 (Jan 27, 2009)

a lot = two words


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## Wallers (Dec 7, 2008)

Thanks ALOT, ******.

:tt2:


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## ryanh (Dec 4, 2009)

Some people are just pricks and dont want furance heat when tapers are in. They are really just screwing themselfs not allowing the mudding process to run its corse. I ain't using propane heaters ever again. too much moisture, can't really push warm air into all rooms if you don't have a whack of heaters. consent propane refills, and if i wanted to get high id smoke a joint not enhale propane :/

turn the heat on. tape. cover the vents, sand. turn heat on..


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## McDusty (Oct 12, 2009)

i've heard that turning on the furnace before hand can void furnace warranty. just what i've heard. not sure if there is any merit to it.


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## roominaday (Feb 14, 2010)

Interesting topic today...I was floating out all the bevel joints in a living room that I taped last December when it was -25 that week with those 220v heaters. I had to haul my own water for this job as well!

I came back in the spring to tape the basement and saw the painted ceilings (HO used paint, no primer - looked like #%$), all the bevel joints had crowned and a few butts were cracked! It turned out there was no insulation in the living room ceiling until later.

So today I repaired around 70 screw pops, taped the cracked butts and coated all the bevel joints. Tomorrow I will paint with a self priming paint from BM - I will post the details of this on PT tomorrow!

Oh well - Billing by the hour on this one to fix it for him and he gave me word today I will be doing his new 10,000 bd ft shop. Board, Tape and Paint!


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## ryanh (Dec 4, 2009)

When you repair cracked butt joints or seams after the board has been painted, what steps do you tape?

When you just mud up some scratchs on a wall that has been primed and one coat of paint. can you just patch and sand and paint over, or can you just prime the patched spot. wait for dry then paint the whole wall ?



roominaday said:


> Interesting topic today...I was floating out all the bevel joints in a living room that I taped last December when it was -25 that week with those 220v heaters. I had to haul my own water for this job as well!
> 
> I came back in the spring to tape the basement and saw the painted ceilings (HO used paint, no primer - looked like #%$), all the bevel joints had crowned and a few butts were cracked! It turned out there was no insulation in the living room ceiling until later.
> 
> ...


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## roominaday (Feb 14, 2010)

ryanh said:


> When you repair cracked butt joints or seams after the board has been painted, what steps do you tape?
> 
> When you just mud up some scratches on a wall that has been primed and one coat of paint. can you just patch and sand and paint over, or can you just prime the patched spot. wait for dry then paint the whole wall ?



In this case the cracks and crowning were from truss up-lift. I re-taped all cracks and finished to a level 4. I have taken a 2" paint scraper and made a channel for the tape to avoid a large build-up as well. I used a self priming ceiling paint from BM and spot primed the repairs with this paint, then cut and rolled 600 square feet of open concept ceiling twice!

Anytime you mud a painted wall (dents, dings, scratches etc) you should spot prime each one or it will flash in the finish. I would love to find a non flashing patching compound! Sometimes, you will get lots of air bubbles in the mud on a painted finish. They will slowly dissipate with each coat.
If its a low sheen paint sometimes you can get away with touching it up with a roller, but I am too fusy and usually I am better off taking the time to roll the whole wall section out. Some of the higher end paints and flat builders paints touch up fairly well - depends on the lighting, colour, sheen etc. I always paint the primed patches, then hit the whole wall if required.


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## ryanh (Dec 4, 2009)

I had someone show me a slight crack they had on there flat ceiling. I coud tell from measurements it was a seam. Ceiling drywall was installed opposide to the way the trusts run.. so theres not consent backing there. It was the only crack. maybe 3 1/2 feet long out of 10' span. was wondering if just a coat of mud would work. so rip out the tape and remud 3 times


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## roominaday (Feb 14, 2010)

If you just fill the crack, it will more than likely crack again. The best way is to re-tape. 

I'd use mesh with 3 coats of fast set..add some heat and fans, spot prime and roll the ceiling and the room would become... *Room In A Day*! I could make some good money on that repair!:thumbup:

Or...search Tapeless mud called Vario in these threads and see if you can get a sample! This product looks very promising.


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## ryanh (Dec 4, 2009)

Im worried about taking the tape down. I think from the look of it the beveled edge of the 2 sheets run down and have 2 pot lights right in the center of the seam so im assuming since they are insulated pot lights that they are boxed in under that drywall and theres nothing to nail the seam too between the lights


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

roominaday said:


> If you just fill the crack, it will more than likely crack again. The best way is to re-tape.
> 
> I'd use mesh with 3 coats of fast set..add some heat and fans, spot prime and roll the ceiling and the room would become... *Room In A Day*! I could make some good money on that repair!:thumbup:
> 
> Or...search Tapeless mud called Vario in these threads and see if you can get a sample! This product looks very promising.


 
He has a problem with CRACKS, why would you use mesh tape,,,

Fix a crack with a product that is GARUNTEED to crack,,,,,

Yeah, that makes sense !!


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## roominaday (Feb 14, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> He has a problem with CRACKS, why would you use mesh tape,,,
> 
> Fix a crack with a product that is GARUNTEED to crack,,,,,
> 
> Yeah, that makes sense !!



I don't entirely disagree with your statement. I use mesh and paper and agree paper is much stronger than mesh. Properly applied, I have success with both. After the paper/mesh thread I am evaluating my use of it (mesh).


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## Saul_Surfaces (Jan 8, 2010)

I've had great luck using the Straightflex tape on problem seams. I've seen it used on homes that have been moved (like down a highway), and it stands up pretty nice. The paper's all cracked before the straightflex fails. It keeps me from getting called back for seams that have been rocked poorly by HO's too. Trouble is that its so thick. You have to feather the mud a long, long way to hide it nice.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Saul_Surfaces said:


> I've had great luck using the Straightflex tape on problem seams. I've seen it used on homes that have been moved (like down a highway), and it stands up pretty nice. The paper's all cracked before the straightflex fails. It keeps me from getting called back for seams that have been rocked poorly by HO's too. Trouble is that its so thick. You have to feather the mud a long, long way to hide it nice.


Your right about striaght-flex, its tough,,,

You need to run it all the way to the middle, just like doing any other corner. when you do; a 5" knive will cover it just like paper tape. If you are trying to "get by" by using the manufacturers "reccomended" way of just swipeing the edges, it will dissapoint you.


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## McDusty (Oct 12, 2009)

last year I was rushed by the GC into taping a few condo townhouses in the boom season before the ski hill was about to open. They hadn't blown in the lids yet((did it after 3 days after i started)... they where heating the place with giant workplace diesel heaters (VERY humid heat)... it was completely F*CKED. To make matters worse, the painter came in... primered & tried coating in same day. EVERYTHING was flashing through and swelling up like a fat kid on halloween. The only reason it was 'drying' between coats was because it was completely baking in there... with diesel heat.

Painter called me on the Saturday that he was doing it, some kind of emergency. I show up and am run down the scenario for him and give him a piece of my mind. To this day I don't know how I didn't get insane call-backs on that.


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## S&SDRYWALL (Oct 21, 2008)

no furnace no tape. propane/diesel heaters are to humid, do it the right way, the first time


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## pipercub17 (Feb 26, 2010)

i always say to the builders i work for. no heat no mud :thumbsup:

roominaday said
. I would love to find a non flashing patching compound

well there are a few products that dap makes 
i like this one the best and it wont flash on ya 

http://www.dap.com/product_details.aspx?BrandID=141&SubcatID=23

and this one http://www.dap.com/product_details.aspx?BrandID=142&SubcatID=23

i use alot of this for bigger repairs too but this one might flash on ya 

http://www.dap.com/product_details.aspx?BrandID=123&SubcatID=20

and you can speed up the drying time with a heat gun or a fan


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## jackleg (Jan 22, 2008)

to repair cracks, dig down into the mud... completely remove existing tape... scape away loose mud.... retape...


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## FOR THOSE ABOUT (Dec 19, 2008)

The DryDex piper mentions is some good stuff. I use it for touch up. Don't be fooled by it's sissy color...it dries white. That no heat thing is how I orginally found this forum and a real PITA. Being from Florida I never had to deal with it prior to arriving in Maine. Just did a Freebie job for Habitat for Humanity. They had heat. Keeped the house cranked up to 70. Doesn't make a whole lotta sense to me when some one is building a million dollar home with 450+ boards and they don't want to do it right the fact that one of the parents 'IS' the local plumber just throws reason right out the door.


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## ryanh (Dec 4, 2009)

What about screw pops.

Finally got the HVAC going. Winter is over and the house is now properly heated. Lumbar is drying/shrinking and between putting the outlet faceplates on and the high heat a few screw pops are popping up.

Whats the best way to do with these when final paint coat has already been applied?? scrap/remud/sand/prime and repaint whole wall ??

any tricks ??


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## jmr (Mar 22, 2010)

a dummy furnace or pod heaters should be set up by the builder.. otherwise i would not warrentee ****! non the less tape in anything below 50 degrees.


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## taper71 (Dec 9, 2007)

Sophie5 said:


> Hello,
> Romark Design Constructions is a luxury Gold Coast home builder specialising in innovative new homes and architecturally designed homes on the Gold Coast with a portfolio of luxury homes in the Sanctuary Cove, Hope Isand and Sovereign Island...
> 
> Thanks


 And what may I ask does this have anything to do with the topic??? Are you just a cheap builder resorting to free advertising now?


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## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

....


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

ryanh said:


> What about screw pops.
> 
> Finally got the HVAC going. Winter is over and the house is now properly heated. Lumbar is drying/shrinking and between putting the outlet faceplates on and the high heat a few screw pops are popping up.
> 
> ...


 What's the finish? If it's smooth it'll be tricky to make it blend, but shouldn't be too tough as long as you keep your mud as minimal as possible. Sand touch ups well, wet sponge away as much mud as you can around the pop. It will be much harder to spot a paint touch-up the size of a dime than it will to see one a roller width wide.


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

Nevermind, you were asking 8 months ago....hopefully you've got it taken care of by now!


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## Terrence (Feb 16, 2011)

Hello,
The odds of an appraisal on a new built home, unless you build super cheap, meeting costs are slim. It will be more like 250k total. Cost of construction presently exceeds property value.


Thanks
_____________


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

ryanh said:


> What about screw pops.
> 
> Finally got the HVAC going. Winter is over and the house is now properly heated. Lumbar is drying/shrinking and between putting the outlet faceplates on and the high heat a few screw pops are popping up.
> 
> ...


welcome to my world baby. the walls i can take care of. no screw pops. the 
ceilings ..... i just cross my fingers. [ the perfect h/o ... ray charles]


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## ns005 (Dec 23, 2010)

I simply just wont finish the job unless the builder/home owner has permanent heat on. You are just asking for trouble finishing a house when it is 0-20F outside with temp heat. I have worked for guys that do it but you usually end up going back and fixing stuff. Plus what happens if the gas runs out or breaker trips? Your mud freezes and you are responsible. Not this guy. :thumbsup: Been there, done that.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

ns005 said:


> I simply just wont finish the job unless the builder/home owner has permanent heat on. You are just asking for trouble finishing a house when it is 0-20F outside with temp heat. I have worked for guys that do it but you usually end up going back and fixing stuff. Plus what happens if the gas runs out or breaker trips? Your mud freezes and you are responsible. Not this guy. :thumbsup: Been there, done that.


you are 100% right nsoo5 , BUT i have to work. if g/c says no current 
no heat, rocks here , i need you here now. what can i do, when i need
the work?? i preach/ i give out literature on wood shrinkage / read the rules/
READ THE BUCKET! bottom line. i hate the cold! but i have to work.


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