# mesh tape or paper tape



## bellas taper

I always wondered why taping jobs failed most of the time as the years gone by. So I was preparing the apartment for my son and his wife in our basement almost 30 years ago. I decided to start over completely. I installed mesh tape everywhere. including the inside corners. I have not had one separation,split or breakdown and still going. Has anyone found this also? I still use paper tape but, those tough repairs always get the mesh tape consideration.


----------



## endo_alley

Kind of a finishing question. I have found that taping flats with mesh tape leaves you with hairline cracks down the road. We always use double mesh tape even on repairs. I don't trust a single layer. And in conjunction with setting compound.


----------



## embella plaster

I personally find hear in aus mesh works fine on flats as long as you use hot mud if you ever use all purpose compound it will 80% crack but even on butts mesh cracks with hot alot i will always use fiber fuse or paper on butts but all repairs are mesh and hot mud for me


----------



## Mudstar

bellas taper said:


> I always wondered why taping jobs failed most of the time as the years gone by. So I was preparing the apartment for my son and his wife in our basement almost 30 years ago. I decided to start over completely. I installed mesh tape everywhere. including the inside corners. I have not had one separation,split or breakdown and still going. Has anyone found this also? I still use paper tape but, those tough repairs always get the mesh tape consideration.


30 year no cracking very impressive. How many times have you painted this area and what kind of paint ?


----------



## bellas taper

I always used Benjamin Moore most of my 47 years in business. I now use Behr paint with primer. I used the same paints in my clients, and the cracks showed. It is not the paint or spackle it is the tape period.


----------



## bellas taper

My climate is not the same and I can understand your results, but you do what you have to do. I repaired many small areas and used both tapes depending on the depth of the repair.


----------



## bellas taper

In 47 years of working I like that I can share of some of the things I have done, thank you for allowing me to share tidbits that I have learned from application.


----------



## bellas taper

I have painted the area at least 5 times. Benjamin Moore and recently Behr preminum paint with primer, good product. No paint out there covers in one coat, unless you prime coat first and tint the primer to match the paint.


----------



## moore

bellas taper said:


> I always wondered why taping jobs failed most of the time as the years gone by. So I was preparing the apartment for my son and his wife in our basement almost 30 years ago. I decided to start over completely. I installed mesh tape everywhere. including the inside corners. I have not had one separation,split or breakdown and still going. Has anyone found this also? I still use paper tape but, those tough repairs always get the mesh tape consideration.



Priceless!! Using Mesh tape to fix Mesh tape cracks! 

The sad fact about this is ....It may hold up the second Go round!! :whistling2:.....:laughing:


----------



## mld

https://youtu.be/FO5fscHFVIA


----------



## embella plaster

Mesh should never be used full stop you dont need to cure a problem thay is done right from the start


----------



## moore

mld said:


> https://youtu.be/FO5fscHFVIA


I was worried there....I thought before I Clicked on that was from my channel !:blink:


----------



## mld

moore said:


> I was worried there....I thought before I Clicked on that was from my channel !:blink:


This one better?

https://youtu.be/xz6OGVCdov8


----------



## thefinisher

IMO, mesh is fine for metal frame structures but not always suitable for wood. There are some instances where there will be cracks regardless of application. The only good thing about mesh is when it cracks it does so very fine and not very noticeable. Paper likes to peak out and is very apparent. Now, we use nothing but paper for all of our houses and even tape with durabond for extra strength so take that for what it is worth.


----------



## Mudstar

anyone I've seen on here that says mesh or fiber is better use to be a painter or is a mor......I'll stop myself right there


----------



## embella plaster

Fibafuse is the shiz


----------



## mld

Mudstar said:


> anyone I've seen on here that says mesh or fiber is better use to be a painter or is a mor......I'll stop myself right there


Why start stopping now


----------



## bellas taper

I never said to use mesh tape all the time, you might assume that but, I just completed a ceiling job on an entire house and used paper tape throughout. Being proud of something has nothing to do with the contents of what you read


----------



## Mudstar

bellas taper said:


> I never said to use mesh tape all the time, you might assume that but, I just completed a ceiling job on an entire house and used paper tape throughout. Being proud of something has nothing to do with the contents of what you read


Your a contractor that paints , you are likely to mix left over paints, tint to match color requested like most of the old painters did back in the day and use water in the process. 

You do this because this is the only way to get away with one coat right? 

You use spackle over tape and its the paper tape that cracks not the paint or the spackle correct?


If you use paper tape but if you find a job tough you consider using mesh tape, you said this ?

I'm sure of a couple things here, you been around, you paint and know how to do wall and ceiling repairs. 

You have shared your tibbit of how too do paint and repair because you feel you should contribute to a community that is very knowledgeable and that you have learned a great deal from lurking through endless treads of key application methods posted by true professionals hoping to gain valuable inside information. 

I bet your glad you found this place......


----------



## endo_alley

"You use spackle over tape and its the paper tape that cracks not the paint or the spackle correct?" Actually, with mesh tape, a hairline crack can form on the wall and get transmitted through the tape without actually cracking the mesh tape. It is merely visible through the gaps in the tape. Since paper tape is solid, any such hairline cracking, which is probably present somewhere along most joints eventually, is hidden by the tape. If there is sufficient movement due to an unstable wall or substrate, paper tape on a joint may also crack. But that is a different scenario. No tape is going to improve the structure of a wall or ceiling.


----------



## embella plaster

If its going to crack its going to crack but i agree paper does a damn good job of hiding that crack


----------



## mld

embella plaster said:


> If its going to crack its going to crack but i agree paper does a damn good job of hiding that crack


And that right there is why I don't use fibafuse.


----------



## moore

endo_alley said:


> "You use spackle over tape and its the paper tape that cracks not the paint or the spackle correct?" Actually, with mesh tape, a hairline crack can form on the wall and get transmitted through the tape without actually cracking the mesh tape. It is merely visible through the gaps in the tape. Since paper tape is solid, any such hairline cracking, which is probably present somewhere along most joints eventually, is hidden by the tape. If there is sufficient movement due to an unstable wall or substrate, paper tape on a joint may also crack. But that is a different scenario. No tape is going to improve the structure of a wall or ceiling.



When they use mesh and hot mud . It takes a while for that hot mud to crack . :yes:


----------



## Mr.Brightstar

Mesh and DuraBond has never let me down. Now if there is Extreme movement there is nothing that will stop it from cracking. I have noticed when people get a new roof there are usually a few cracks that show up on the ceiling regardless of tape/mud.


----------



## Mr.Brightstar

One flaw with mesh is that it goes before the mud. How is this adding any strength to the mud when the mud goes on top of the tape. Paper and fiber fuse are sandwiched between the mud, floating in the mud. If mesh was floating in the mud it would add more strength to the mud.

JMHO


----------



## bellas taper

You must be a expert!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## bellas taper

Not true the mud goes through as the paper tape has to have it apply prior to cover with mud


----------



## bellas taper

That is what I been saying. I have worked on vacation homes in N.Y. State from upstate to the Hamptons and those stubborn cracks I treated with mesh tape / durobond combo and most of the times it resolved the problem


----------



## bellas taper

Did you ever demo mesh taped jobs, that's when you will see and feel the difference.


----------



## moore

bellas taper said:


> Did you ever demo mesh taped jobs, that's when you will see and feel the difference.


Yes I have many times....all the mesh was cracked all to chit...but it was a bitch to pull off.


----------



## cazna

I like Tits


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

& lady bits.


----------



## cazna

Roses are tits
Violets are tits
I like tits
Tits.


----------



## MrWillys

Straight outta Gutta


----------



## cazna

MrWillys said:


> Straight outta Gutta


 I thought it was very romantic poam?

I cant for the life of me bare to get into this thread, Sorry my mind wandered off.


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

Remember this Caz?
http://www.drywalltalk.com/f12/its-all-over-3810/
That's romantic !!!!!!!!!!


----------



## cazna

Lol. I forgot about that one.


----------



## embella plaster

Gee thought this was a place of zen and peace


----------



## cazna

embella plaster said:


> Gee thought this was a place of zen and peace


 Im sure quiet a few like the peace pipes.


----------



## embella plaster

Dont tell anyone that was in confidence caz


----------



## bellas taper

I found this year plus ago and didn't like the comments then about the responds to some of the input, so i walked away for awhile. Yes I do paint small jobs like one room or bath/kitchen job, don't want to bother my painter for small jobs. I like to keep up with new products also, wouldn't know if something is good without doing it.


----------



## bellas taper

I have removed paper tape walls and mesh tapes walls, a little tuffer with the mesh tape and brings me to the conclusion that a little tuffer to crack. Any poor construction job will fail regardless of any tape period.


----------



## bellas taper

That job I did was for my own and wanted to see if there is a difference. That's all it was not to tell you how you like to do things. I like to explore and maybe find something new that works better, simple.


----------



## bellas taper

You wish you had my knowledge it comes with 48 years of just doing it. And please quote me accurately, when did I say one coat primer and then paint equals two coats. Why do you think it's your duty to attack ? Don't answer, because I have no interest in YOUR answer.


----------



## embella plaster

I have a cat


----------



## gazman

I hate cats :yes:.


----------



## gazman

Two of my pet hates in one post. Lol


----------



## embella plaster

Haha was breaking up the verbal brawl


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

gazman said:


> Two of my pet hates in one post. Lol


I didn't take you for a hater, Gazman. 
I like all animals,,, even snakes :blink:. Unless there a poisonous hazzard on my property,,, but it's nothing personal. 
Animals are true to nature, humans aren't.
If someone used mesh tape on a job,,, I'd take it personal.


----------



## moore

bellas taper said:


> I have removed paper tape walls and mesh tapes walls, a little tuffer with the mesh tape and brings me to the conclusion that a little tuffer to crack. Any poor construction job will fail regardless of any tape period.


You said period ...I guess that's the end of that!!


----------



## embella plaster

Period yummo


----------



## gazman

P.A. ROCKER said:


> I didn't take you for a hater, Gazman.
> I like all animals,,, even snakes :blink:. Unless there a poisonous hazzard on my property,,, but it's nothing personal.
> Animals are true to nature, humans aren't.
> If someone used mesh tape on a job,,, I'd take it personal.



We have a real problem over here with feral cats. They are reeking havoc on the native birds and small animals. People let their domestic cats roam and our native birds suffer. 
So I guess my statement was a bit harsh, I hate what they are doing to the environment. Our native species are very special, most of them are not found anywhere else in the world and to see them wiped out would be a disaster.
We are paying for decisions made in the past. Cane toads were introduced to kill a beetle that was affecting the sugar Cain, now they are going through the top end of the country including a very special place called Kakadu. They secrete a toxin through their skin, so any animal that attacks one dies from the toxin, including snakes, lizards, and crocs. 
European card were introduced to clean out weed that was growing in irrigation channels, now they are in plague numbers through out most of our fresh water lakes and rivers. They are bottom feeders and cause erosion and put pressure on our native fish for real estate. 

Like you PA, I love animals (venomous snakes dont last long in my yard either) but to me our native animals are far more important, after all that is what works best for an ecological balance.


----------



## cazna

Exactly the same here, Bloody cats killing birds etc etc, I don't like them either.


----------



## moore

I hate cats.


----------



## Aussiecontractor

So does my dog ,I can't even say the word or she goes mental, she learnt the word cat by herself we didn't teach her... Crazy










Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

moore said:


> I hate cats.


Maybe you need a rodent problem to change your mind.:whistling2:


----------



## P.E.I.Taper

Fox problem round here, fat city foxes. Skinny ones live out in the country!


----------



## gopherstateguy

We have fat city coyotes here:yes: They eat small pets


----------



## moore

P.A. ROCKER said:


> Maybe you need a rodent problem to change your mind.:whistling2:


The cat ate my chimp munks !! I had two pair here for the last 10 years ..now they're gone. Living here for 17 years I've never seen a blue jay till 2 years ago ...The cat killed them!! :furious:



I hate cats!! :yes:


----------



## moore

gopherstateguy said:


> We have fat city coyotes here:yes: They eat small pets


We have Coyotes bad! I have a den 1/4 mile behind my home .

I can walk out on my back deck right now and hear them crying ..It's gotten pretty bad here.. A Nearby hunting club dug up a den with a back hoe and found bones from every domestic critter you could imagine ..They said the den was full of dog collars .


----------



## mld

moore said:


> The cat ate my chimp munks !! I had two pair here for the last 10 years ..now they're gone. Living here for 17 years I've never seen a blue jay till 2 years ago ...The cat killed them!! :furious:
> 
> 
> 
> I hate cats!! :yes:


Around here blue jays are the coyotes of the air.


----------



## Mudstar

Its unreal how humans manipulate life with all this regulation that keeps piling up, gun control that was suppose to prevents unneeded death and protect gone completely upside down. 

Heath care allowing doctors to administer mind altering drugs that has caused some of this mass shooting here in North America not only mind altering but heath controlling deaths and wipe there hands clean of responsibility. 

On a world wide scale with war against others because we want something they have or don't like how they conduct they business affairs. 

The wildlife ya'll speaking about now. 

Seems to me we are acting like god (((?))) who the hell introduced that dam book they call the bible anyways. Maybe there happens to be the problem...... JS


----------



## endo_alley

moore said:


> We have Coyotes bad! I have a den 1/4 mile behind my home .
> 
> I can walk out on my back deck right now and hear them crying ..It's gotten pretty bad here.. A Nearby hunting club dug up a den with a back hoe and found bones from every domestic critter you could imagine ..They said the den was full of dog collars .


Hell that ain't nuthin. We git these bigfoot criiters time to time. They don't bother the dogs much. But whenever my beer is a missin, the kid says he seen the bigfoots come and took it. Last week I had a couple of T bones gone from the fridge and a couple of bakin taters. Bigfoot got them too. Kid got some pitcures of'm. He's a good kid.


----------



## cazna

Mudstar said:


> who the hell introduced that dam book they call the bible anyways. Maybe there happens to be the problem...... JS


 
Agreed, Einstein said the bibles just fables of mans weaknesses.

I went to a catholic school and everyone in my class left school thinking it was rubbish, How can we believe and follow a load of story's from thousands of years ago that was probably formed and distorted over thousands of years of opinions anyway.

But sometimes religion has its place, I do like how it can bring people together to help and support each other and community's.

Do unto others as you would like done to yourself.
The ten commandments etc etc.

There are good messages to live by unfortunately the other side of religion that causes so much disruption, I just don't understand how it becomes that.


----------



## moore

cazna said:


> Agreed, Einstein said the bibles just fables of mans weaknesses.



He also said ...Compounding interest is the most powerful force on the planet. He hit that on the head!!!:yes:.......


----------



## MrWillys

Oh great, Drywallers quoting Einstein right after a Bigfoot post. To freakin funny!


----------



## Kiwiman

MrWillys said:


> Oh great, Drywallers quoting Einstein right after a Bigfoot post. To freakin funny!


Mesh, tits, cats, religion, Bigfoot, Einstein ......:laughing:


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

I must admit,,,, this is the best mesh/paper thread *ever*.


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

Mudstar said:


> Its unreal how humans manipulate life with all this regulation that keeps piling up, gun control that was suppose to prevents unneeded death and protect gone completely upside down.
> 
> Heath care allowing doctors to administer mind altering drugs that has caused some of this mass shooting here in North America not only mind altering but heath controlling deaths and wipe there hands clean of responsibility.
> 
> On a world wide scale with war against others because we want something they have or don't like how they conduct they business affairs.
> 
> The wildlife ya'll speaking about now.
> 
> Seems to me we are acting like god (((?))) who the hell introduced that dam book they call the bible anyways. Maybe there happens to be the problem...... JS



Mudstar,,, That has to be the finest post I've read of yours. 
Much obliged.


----------



## bellas taper

no one to blame, except the people that made those choices. This is far from the sheetrock conversation!


----------



## P.E.I.Taper

Sometimes it sucks when threads get off topic, I find this one more beneficial to our moral!

Rather than taking the long way to find out paper is stronger. ...again. 

Can we get this back onto the tits again?


----------



## endo_alley

bellas taper said:


> no one to blame, except the people that made those choices. This is far from the sheetrock conversation!


We're mad as hell. And we're not going to take it anymore.


----------



## Kiwiman

And the winner is.....
*FIBAFUSE!!!* :thumbup:
Nah just kidding, it's obviously tits :thumbsup:


----------



## cazna

P.E.I.Taper said:


> Can we get this back onto the tits again?


 Gladly, Tomtits, Native birds that the Cats are killing here, I love Tomtits, Dam Cats. What else did you guys think I was talking about 

P.S. Fibafuse rules :whistling2:


----------



## endo_alley

cazna said:


> Agreed, Einstein said the bibles just fables of mans weaknesses.
> 
> I went to a catholic school and everyone in my class left school thinking it was rubbish, How can we believe and follow a load of story's from thousands of years ago that was probably formed and distorted over thousands of years of opinions anyway.
> 
> But sometimes religion has its place, I do like how it can bring people together to help and support each other and community's.
> 
> Do unto others as you would like done to yourself.
> The ten commandments etc etc.
> 
> There are good messages to live by unfortunately the other side of religion that causes so much disruption, I just don't understand how it becomes that.


"How can we believe and follow a load of story's from thousands of years ago that was probably formed and distorted over thousands of years of opinions anyway." We are really getting way out of line on this thread. But a book called" the meme machine" by Susan Blackmore takes a pretty good stab at that question. While neither supporting or condemning religion, or political beliefs, or any other ideas, she explains how they "replicate" from person to person.


----------



## moore

In my travels I've seen paper and hot mud hold like a mother. But I do breasts !!!


----------



## bellas taper

where do I start and end on many subjects of life's experience, it's endless for me and I am getting off the track of this forum. I live each day to my belief that I have choices and what I do will effect me, sometime for the rest of my life, sometimes good or bad or both.


----------



## bellas taper

everyone is allowed a opinion that's what made America great.


----------



## Mudstar

bellas taper said:


> everyone is allowed a opinion that's what made America great.


and made America look really bad too


----------



## MrWillys

endo_alley said:


> "How can we believe and follow a load of story's from thousands of years ago that was probably formed and distorted over thousands of years of opinions anyway." We are really getting way out of line on this thread. But a book called" the meme machine" by Susan Blackmore takes a pretty good stab at that question. While neither supporting or condemning religion, or political beliefs, or any other ideas, she explains how they "replicate" from person to person.


I agree with this 100%. One time I went to Sunday lunch in Enid, OK and all the men had on suits from going to church. It was 100 degrees (38C) and I had on my Levis 501 button fly and sandals. You talk about feeling like the odd man out. I felt like an acid dropping hippie from San Francisco. My father in law never said a word and I thought what in the world did I get myself into.


----------



## cazna

Funny how you mention religion, Then its getting way out of line.

Not allowed to talk about it, Not allowed to have an opinion on it, Not allowed to question any of it, Just accept it and that's it....................Feels like im back at school. ?


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

cazna said:


> Funny how you mention religion, Then its getting way out of line.
> 
> Not allowed to talk about it, Not allowed to have an opinion on it, Not allowed to question any of it, Just accept it and that's it....................Feels like im back at school. ?


Here's my opinion,,, I believe there's a higher power than me,,,_ actually what it is_, I don't know, to me it's god. 
I'm not a church going bible thumper, but I believe we have reason.
I don't believe the human race is totally random.


----------



## Mudstar

P.A. ROCKER said:


> I don't believe the human race is totally random.


Not totally but 99.9% random


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

But what does that 1/10 of 1% mean to you?


----------



## endo_alley

P.A. ROCKER said:


> Here's my opinion,,, I believe there's a higher power than me,,,_ actually what it is_, I don't know, to me it's god.
> I'm not a church going bible thumper, but I believe we have reason.
> I don't believe the human race is totally random.


I've dealt with that higher power. And been humbled by it. It calls itself " The painters and allied trades union".


----------



## Mudstar

P.A. ROCKER said:


> But what does that 1/10 of 1% mean to you?


 We are all random in all we do. I don't know one man or woman that is mirroring anyone to a tee.


----------



## moore

Here we go all up in the God thang!

I'm just a dumb ole hillbilly ..But the way I see It ...We live on a planet that's just a speck in the universe . There's just way too much out there to say one cat is running this gig. 

They say without Religion this world would be Chaos ! But Look at the World we live in . And the Chaos religions has caused .


----------



## endo_alley

moore said:


> Here we go all up in the God thang!
> 
> I'm just a dumb ole hillbilly ..But the way I see It ...We live on a planet that's just a speck in the universe . There's just way too much out there to say one cat is running this gig.
> 
> They say without Religion this world would be Chaos ! But Look at the World we live in . And the Chaos religions has caused .


Sam Harris has some good youtube videos on this subject, where both sides make good points. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg7p1BjP2dA Also Matt Dilahunty and Aron Ra on the secular side of the argument.


----------



## bellas taper

if you are going to talk about religion, then whether you believe or not is not the issue it is that people think strongly about it and enough to kill you for it or because of their beliefs. Why talk about a subject that most people don't know what they are talking about!


----------



## P.E.I.Taper

bellas taper said:


> if you are going to talk about religion, then whether you believe or not is not the issue it is that people think strongly about it and enough to kill you for it or because of their beliefs. Why talk about a subject that most people don't know what they are talking about!



This entire website is just opinion. So why would we listen To you if you dont know what the **** you are talking about?


----------



## bellas taper

You must be the Grand Pubba, Who do you think you are senior member that hasn't learn any class. Other people, besides you have a different view and your your respond is to tell them to **** off. Great respond, you must converse well in a bar about 1 am in the morning. That is why this forum could use a little cleansing of rotted old wood.


----------



## P.E.I.Taper

I said that because you dismissed someones opinion... so if you dont want to hear his opinion, why should I listen to yours??

I have learned alot from this forum and .
Peoples opinion, and I am going to continue to do so.


----------



## endo_alley

This post has really gone off the rails. I kind of like it every once in a while. But we haven't even touched politics yet. So I ask, who hangs better board, Republicans, Democrats, or independents? Or maybe it is PRI vs PAN?


----------



## MrWillys

endo_alley said:


> This post has really gone off the rails. I kind of like it every once in a while. But we haven't even touched politics yet. So I ask, who hangs better board, Republicans, Democrats, or independents? Or maybe it is PRI vs PAN?


 This is to simple, Democrats are Union so they are trained professionals.


----------



## endo_alley

MrWillys said:


> This is to simple, Democrats are Union so they are trained professionals.


What about Partido Revolucionario Institucional ? They say they hang a lot of of the rock these days.


----------



## moore

MrWillys said:


> This is to simple, Democrats are Union so they are trained communist


I fixed that for you ..


----------



## Wimpy65

MrWillys said:


> This is to simple, Democrats are Union so they are trained professionals.


Now that's funny! :thumbup:
I knew we could count on you Mr Willys. :thumbsup:

I'm just a country boy; I've never been Union or very political, for that matter. I guess, by definition, I'm a professional because I get paid for what I do. A couple years ago Pennsylvania started a program that requires a license. But, don't be impressed, anyone willing to pay $50 can get one. 
I must admit I would like the idea of a true license (one that actually takes training). In our area, it's far to easy to decide you are now a drywall contractor. But, forgive me Mr Willys, I can't bring myself to wish Unions on our area.


----------



## Mr.Brightstar

A Republican gets paid by the square foot when the job is done.

A Democrat gets paid by the hour no matter how long the job takes.

My moneys on the independent contractor working for himself. He gets the most done in the shortest amount of time. I wish our country worked like that.

Make America great again.


----------



## MrWillys

Wimpy65 said:


> Now that's funny! :thumbup:
> I knew we could count on you Mr Willys. :thumbsup:
> 
> I'm just a country boy; I've never been Union or very political, for that matter. I guess, by definition, I'm a professional because I get paid for what I do. A couple years ago Pennsylvania started a program that requires a license. But, don't be impressed, anyone willing to pay $50 can get one.
> I must admit I would like the idea of a true license (one that actually takes training). In our area, it's far to easy to decide you are now a drywall contractor. But, forgive me Mr Willys, I can't bring myself to wish Unions on our area.


Caught me didn't you? I'm actually quite the centrist. I will say my union does a lot of good. I used to teach confined space training. I was fortunate enough to be an Instructor at the Carpenters International Las Vegas training center and taught other Instructors. This teaches our people not to jump into places that can be oxygen deficient or enriched. Tunnels, tanks, and utility vaults. Just remember that for me it was pure luck. I count my blessings every day to be so fortunate.
To become a journeyman a Carpenter must complete 576 hours of school and have a minimum of 4800 work hours.


----------



## MrWillys

Mr.Brightstar said:


> A Republican gets paid by the square foot when the job is done.
> 
> A Democrat gets paid by the hour no matter how long the job takes.
> 
> My moneys on the independent contractor working for himself. He gets the most done in the shortest amount of time. I wish our country worked like that.
> 
> Make America great again.


 Piecework is legal in my union and I did it for many years.


----------



## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> A Republican gets paid by the square foot when the job is done.
> 
> A Democrat gets paid by the hour no matter how long the job takes.
> 
> My moneys on the independent contractor working for himself. He gets the most done in the shortest amount of time. I wish our country worked like that.
> 
> Make America great again.



YES SIR!!! :yes::yes::yes:


----------



## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> A Republican gets paid by the square foot when the job is done.
> 
> A Democrat gets paid by the hour no matter how long the job takes.
> 
> My moneys on the independent contractor working for himself. He gets the most done in the shortest amount of time. I wish our country worked like that.
> 
> Make America great again.



YES SIR!!! :yes::yes::yes: Make them lazy bastards get out there and work for It!!!!


----------



## endo_alley

Mr.Brightstar said:


> A Republican gets paid by the square foot when the job is done.
> 
> A Democrat gets paid by the hour no matter how long the job takes.
> 
> My moneys on the independent contractor working for himself. He gets the most done in the shortest amount of time. I wish our country worked like that.
> 
> Make America great again.


That's good old days old school JFK vs Barry Goldwater ideology. Modern Republican sends the entire job off to China done cheap and brings it back in a shipping container, while modern Democrat is occupying Wall street yelling "black lives matter" at a cop trying to keep the peace. Nobody left to do the work. All gone crazy.


----------



## P.A. ROCKER

MrWillys said:


> Piecework is legal in my union and I did it for many years.


That means you'd be an independent contractor on the east coast.:yes:


----------



## Mr.Brightstar

endo_alley said:


> That's good old days old school JFK vs Barry Goldwater ideology. Modern Republican sends the entire job off to China done cheap and brings it back in a shipping container, while modern Democrat is occupying Wall street yelling "black lives matter" at a cop trying to keep the peace. Nobody left to do the work. All gone crazy.



Our government is being run by criminals, gangsters. The establishment on both sides has sold the people out.


----------



## moore

P.A. ROCKER said:


> That means you'd be an independent contractor on the east coast.:yes:


Or a crack whore !


----------



## Kiwiman

http://www.drywalltalk.com/f12/dwt-boxing-ring-9842/ :yes:


----------



## bellas taper

By insulting people, great. You. for sure missed the point again. What makes you the defender of people that don't need defending. We are all adults and I or we don't need a mommy, "god" you are so full of yourself. Please ask you not respond to me anymore.


----------



## bellas taper

I wish that to, but in the real world, unless we take our country back we will be under these lowlife politician who don't give a crap about you and me.


----------



## embella plaster

Hmmmm mesh or paper tape :sly:


----------



## MrWillys

moore said:


> Or a crack whore !


 Aren't they both about the same?


----------



## P.E.I.Taper

Crack heads dont take a day off??


----------



## moore

bellas taper said:


> By insulting people, great. You. for sure missed the point again. What makes you the defender of people that don't need defending. We are all adults and I or we don't need a mommy, "god" you are so full of yourself. Please ask you not respond to me anymore.


NY. Let me guess!!!:whistling2:


----------



## embella plaster

I wish i understood all this politics crap but i dont all i know is the media make obama look awesome and trump look like a dck with good points.....australian media anyways


----------



## moore

embella plaster said:


> I wish i understood all this politics crap but i dont all i know is the media make obama look awesome and trump look like a dck with good points.....australian media anyways


No..we don't have much going for us over here as far as presidents go...Obama's on his way down to visit Cuba. And the hookers in Nevada are raising funds for Hilary Clinton's campaign ....I'm sure slick Willie had something to do with that. :whistling2:


----------



## bellas taper

common sense


----------



## MrWillys

embella plaster said:


> I wish i understood all this politics crap but i dont all i know is the media make obama look awesome and trump look like a dck with good points.....australian media anyways


 First, trump makes himself look like a dck and he doesn't need any help from media. The US, just like Australia has long had a higher standard of living. Both are currently suffering from outsourcing of manufacturing. Auto makers in both countries (as well as other industries) are moving to countries where labor is much cheaper. This in turn creates lower medium incomes and a growing need for government support in our economies. The conservative approach in both countries is to let them starve and the progressive approach is handouts. Honestly, the answer really lies somewhere in the middle.

Here, both parties have allowed illegal immigration that has driven down wages. it could be solved by E-Verify which neither party has supported. Instead, we get a loud mouth who claims he'll build a wall and get others to pay for it. However, we already have a wall and they tunnel underneath it.

Bottom line is that globalization of all our economies has created this and the 1% are currently allowed to control the outcome. The reality is we need to bring back respect for the working persons toil and quit the thought of low wage employment. The person that stocks the shelf at the grocery store should be valued similar to you sanding drywall.


----------



## endo_alley

MrWillys said:


> First, trump makes himself look like a dck and he doesn't need any help from media. The US, just like Australia has long had a higher standard of living. Both are currently suffering from outsourcing of manufacturing. Auto makers in both countries (as well as other industries) are moving to countries where labor is much cheaper. This in turn creates lower medium incomes and a growing need for government support in our economies. The conservative approach in both countries is to let them starve and the progressive approach is handouts. Honestly, the answer really lies somewhere in the middle.
> 
> Here, both parties have allowed illegal immigration that has driven down wages. it could be solved by E-Verify which neither party has supported. Instead, we get a loud mouth who claims he'll build a wall and get others to pay for it. However, we already have a wall and they tunnel underneath it.
> 
> Bottom line is that globalization of all our economies has created this and the 1% are currently allowed to control the outcome. The reality is we need to bring back respect for the working persons toil and quit the thought of low wage employment. The person that stocks the shelf at the grocery store should be valued similar to you sanding drywall.


 How about this summary of things -The plight of the construction worker is almost entirely a product of illegal immigration compounded by the collapsed housing bubble. And the housing bubble was due in part by illegal immigration. We could have never built hundreds of thousands of homes that nobody wanted to buy, were it not for the influx of cheaper immigrant labor willing to build them. American citizens have always been able to meet the demand for construction projects in the past. Whether it was roads, dams or homes. But during times of very hot demand wages would also go up due to low rates of unemployment. These higher wages would cool the demand enough keep these "bubbles " from getting out of control. The bubble of the early 2000's never had this labor negative feedback loop. And so it spiraled out of control. And after the bubble burst and there was a ten year supply of unsold homes, killing demand for labor, and killing wages, a lot of Americans left the low paying trades. Leaving mostly immigrant labor who have no choice but to work as lower wage contract labor. I think Trump's popularity, despite his obvious negative attributes, is because of this situation.


----------



## bellas taper

As I see it, everyone that voted for any political person got what they deserved. Obama bought his second term, by giving the store away and no one to pay for it. The one percent or the ten percent, if all their money way taken away wouldn't even cover twenty percent of the entire debt. When you accept a check from the government and know you did nothing for it, you are the cause and only got yourself to blame. I don't give a **** who's elected, but Trump is striking a cord that people are thinking the same way and are sick of politician.


----------



## bellas taper

Bar stool economic. When you beat the company to death with rules to work in the USA, and don't allow growth, they leave it's that simply. Trump can fix this, because what he is saying is touching a nerve, so don't blame the messenger only yourself if you don't see the common sense in his solutions.


----------



## endo_alley

"Bar stool economic. When you beat the company to death with rules to work in the USA, and don't allow growth, they leave it's that simply. Trump can fix this, because what he is saying is touching a nerve, so don't blame the messenger only yourself if you don't see the common sense in his solutions. " **********************************
I hear a lot of people saying similar stuff to what you are saying. This will be a weird election. The party bosses have lost control.


----------



## embella plaster

Guys no matter what chuck these between ceiling joins and it will make a lot less chance of cracking....back blocks


----------



## moore

embella plaster said:


> Guys no matter what chuck these between ceiling joins and it will make a lot less chance of cracking....back blocks


16 oc would help too!


----------



## P.E.I.Taper

embella plaster said:


> Guys no matter what chuck these between ceiling joins and it will make a lot less chance of cracking....back blocks


You guys block inbetween all framing on everysheet? That would be so easy going sheetrock!


----------



## embella plaster

Only ceilings......but in 10 years never a crack with hot mud ran in paper or fuse


----------



## embella plaster

moore said:


> 16 oc would help too!


16 oc???????????


----------



## P.E.I.Taper

Space you battems at a max of 406.4mm apart. From center to center


----------



## D A Drywall

embella plaster said:


> Guys no matter what chuck these between ceiling joins and it will make a lot less chance of cracking....back blocks


Is that just scrap board with some type of glue?


----------



## embella plaster

Yeah not with glue as glue shrinks in cold and expands in heat= cracks.....its a form of hot mud called back back block cement


----------



## Custom Drywall

Small jobs i will mesh and hot mud seams and butts. Just so I can speed the job up. Large jobs paper all the way. Just used fibafuse in the past 3 small jobs to test out what it can and cant do for me. 1st job did all the corners in FF turned out well. Next job the whole closet got FF turned out well. 3rd job ran FF for whole job and in hot mud and was pleased with the results. More expensive than paper but will have it on hand for sure.


----------

