# how do you fasten your steel beads?



## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

i'm not super experienced with steel beads but i use them every now and again for various reasons. i have a hard time because i know i'm lacking some very simple instruction on the order of fastening. my main problem is i have a hard time getting them totally square and the flange often ends up sticking out a little in some spots requiring extra fastening to hold it down. i usually like to coat my steel with mesh on the flange and then a good setting mud for first coat. i've also never used a crimper. i bought one once from home depot ages ago and it didn't work. i usually staple steel beads on.

so i'm just wondering things like top first ,bottom first, middle first ,one side at a time etc. I've just never been shown.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Start in the middle 1 fastener on each side then go up or down driving 1 fastener on each side as you go while pushing on the nose of the bead. Never fasten one side then the other..I use the hatchet end of my hatchet as a guide as I go. Or a framers square will work / 6'' knife etc....Making sure the board is tight to the lumber is a must also.


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## chris (Apr 13, 2011)

Moore said it right:thumbsup: another tip is to use your foot as a guide/hold meaning when you are installing, use your foot to hold bottom of stick where it needs to be and use both hands ( one high and one in middle)to check alignment,, then shoot. Hope you can see what I mean. Usually over crimping/ pushing the bead on too far causes that flange to stick out so dont be afraid to let it take a fill. Most problems I have metal bead is over crimping


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## Philma Crevices (Jan 28, 2012)

These make it a breeze getting metal bead on. check the bead with your 6 and you can toss nails/staples after getting it on with the clinch if you prefer, still much faster. I use a bigger mallet than what they come with for more oomph to drive the flanges a bit deeper without much force.

Home depot clinchs blow, they are a bit too wide so they dont indent the metal enough to hold to the drywall. Canza I think? had a pic of a fix he did, gluing a tab of platic on each side of a crap clinch to dial it in. Clinch on brand is what we use.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Philma Crevices said:


> These make it a breeze getting metal bead on. check the bead with your 6 and you can toss nails/staples after getting it on with the clinch if you prefer, still much faster. I use a bigger mallet than what they come with for more oomph to drive the flanges a bit deeper without much force.
> 
> Home depot clinchs blow, they are a bit too wide so they dont indent the metal enough to hold to the drywall. Canza I think? had a pic of a fix he did, gluing a tab of platic on each side of a crap clinch to dial it in. Clinch on brand is what we use.


 cliched bead with no fasteners will edge crack ... You must be taping your flanges after crimping??


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## Philma Crevices (Jan 28, 2012)

Here's Gaz's fix if you have a clinch still. If not Clinch On brand is the way to go



http://www.drywalltalk.com/f9/bead-prices-your-area-3031/ post 35


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## Philma Crevices (Jan 28, 2012)

moore said:


> cliched bead with no fasteners will edge crack ... You must be taping your flanges after crimping??


 Yah, we mesh. All comercial so no trim guys banging our **** to hell


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## Square Foot (Jul 1, 2012)

Philma Crevices said:


> These make it a breeze getting metal bead on. check the bead with your 6 and you can toss nails/staples after getting it on with the clinch if you prefer, still much faster. I use a bigger mallet than what they come with for more oomph to drive the flanges a bit deeper without much force.
> 
> Home depot clinchs blow, they are a bit too wide so they dont indent the metal enough to hold to the drywall. Canza I think? had a pic of a fix he did, gluing a tab of platic on each side of a crap clinch to dial it in. Clinch on brand is what we use.


If memory serves? clinchers are made in 1-1/4 and 1-1/8th sizes.

I don't really care for them as they don't allow for bead adjustment, if it should be necessary.


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

trim tex staples


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## Square Foot (Jul 1, 2012)

icerock drywall said:


> trim tex staples


Not familiar with that bead in your pic....what brand is that?


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

Square Foot said:


> Not familiar with that bead in your pic....what brand is that?


steel mesh...i like it


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## Philma Crevices (Jan 28, 2012)

Square Foot said:


> If memory serves? clinchers are made in 1-1/4 and 1-1/8th sizes.
> 
> I don't really care for them as they don't allow for bead adjustment, if it should be necessary.


 You can adjust side to side by hitting the body of the clinch left or right, we do this especialy if on side has a recess an other not. 
And you're right about the sizes, but I dont think the smaller size bead is produced anymore?


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

bullnose


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## Square Foot (Jul 1, 2012)

Philma Crevices said:


> You can adjust side to side by hitting the body of the clinch left or right, we do this especialy if on side has a recess an other not.
> And you're right about the sizes, but I dont think the smaller size bead is produced anymore?


Yes, side to side...but should you have to adjust outward ( pinch ) it becomes more limited.


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

moore said:


> Start in the middle 1 fastener on each side then go up or down driving 1 fastener on each side as you go while pushing on the nose of the bead. Never fasten one side then the other..I use the hatchet end of my hatchet as a guide as I go. Or a framers square will work / 6'' knife etc....Making sure the board is tight to the lumber is a must also.


this basically how i,ve been doing it. i think i read it somewhere a long time ago. i still find i don't always get it on as tight as using paper bead and a roller. i get it on better when i staple than when i nail. i'm not saying i have been having major problems just not as consistent as i would like. i find it hard to keep totally consistent pressure on the nose at every fastening point. just need more practice i guess.


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Square Foot said:


> If memory serves? clinchers are made in 1-1/4 and 1-1/8th sizes.
> 
> I don't really care for them as they don't allow for bead adjustment, if it should be necessary.


Your memory is right:thumbsup:

And just before they band the clincher up here in Banada where I live, They were making them better. You could adjust the pins and side arms with a set screw (allen key). If you make the arms bend out more, you don't half to hit them so hard, and you can get the pins to fire in really deep. Got to the point you could ALMOST not boot them off with your foot...... But who cares,,,, long live paper bead:thumbup:


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

carpentaper said:


> this basically how i,ve been doing it. i think i read it somewhere a long time ago. i still find i don't always get it on as tight as using paper bead and a roller. i get it on better when i staple than when i nail. i'm not saying i have been having major problems just not as consistent as i would like. i find it hard to keep totally consistent pressure on the nose at every fastening point. just need more practice i guess.


 None of my shiny 90s are ever perfect ..I tried something out of the norm recently..I put 2 screws at the top 2 screws at the bottom ,,and 1 at the seam then paper taped the flange on each side with a/p.. Took alot of mud to fill though.. But I walked away with little worries of pops or edge cracks....I prefer paper face bead ,but still use the phillips when they send it out..


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## PrecisionTaping (Feb 2, 2012)

Steel beads!?
I fasten those in a dumpster around back :jester::yes:
Where they belong.


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

carpentaper said:


> this basically how i,ve been doing it. i think i read it somewhere a long time ago. i still find i don't always get it on as tight as using paper bead and a roller. i get it on better when i staple than when i nail. i'm not saying i have been having major problems just not as consistent as i would like. i find it hard to keep totally consistent pressure on the nose at every fastening point. just need more practice i guess.


That's where us strong husky guys like me and sdrdrywall have a advantage over you little guys, we can put our body weight into them:thumbup:

One piece of advice, put them on tight, never loose, metal bead has a big nose:yes:
Pay attention to the holes on the bead, use them as you guide. If one side is tight, yet the other side is not, adjust it. Or, if you see air/space by looking at the holes. Looking at the holes lets you know if you have it on right. Push hard on the bead, watch the holes, tap bead left or right by hand or hammer, when you see no space under the holes, on both sides, their on right and tight.

Let the bead float, over the bows (release pressure a bit)


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## harvey randall (Nov 23, 2010)

*plaster mesh*



icerock drywall said:


> steel mesh...i like it


 plasterrrrrrr mesh got the characters in- thanks


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## DLSdrywall (May 22, 2012)

Actually metal beads are all we use. Guys usually nail them in. I personally get my compressor and stapler and staple my beads much faster. I stagger my staples to minimize buckling because the framming is usually chit! Pre-cut everything then go nuts installing. On side jobs i use vinyl i hate paper faced beads no offense.:blink:


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## Tucker (Feb 2, 2012)

I am with you on that DLS. Give me some metal and a stapler...I can make some wicked time. Builders in my neck of the woods dont give a chit...low bid gets the job...most of the time


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

Tucker said:


> I am with you on that DLS. Give me some metal and a stapler...I can make some wicked time. Builders in my neck of the woods dont give a chit...low bid gets the job...most of the time


Yep same here.... that is why we usually bid to use metal. Lately, though I have convinced my dad (aka boss man) to start stocking paper faced bead in our jobs so I can compare any differences at time of point up. I will report back my findings....


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

harvey randall said:


> plasterrrrrrr mesh got the characters in- thanks


 way better than paper !!!


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## chris (Apr 13, 2011)

Hitachi stapeler 1-1/4" stapels ( 1/4" crown) Grip rite 2 HP compressor, and I like to use the red snips for bullnose


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## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

One advantage of metal, it actually has a bead, unlike paper faced. I find that paper faced beads, you have to sand it to a point. The metal takes care of that for you.

Any overspill on metal, you can just skim off with your knife/trowel, on paper you end up taking mud off the other side.

You can box metal beads without worrying about tearing it up.

However, metal bead doesn't come to a sharp point like you can get with a paper bead.


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## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

One advantage I find with paper, is the speed, we'll break up, one person doing the whole sticks, the other doing the cuts. Run them through the hopper, and stick an entire floor at once, roll, and wipe. Done and move on.

The other significant advantage if find with paper, is when properly applied, they take a LOT less mud. This means faster drying time, and less shrinkage.


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## Square Foot (Jul 1, 2012)

fr8train said:


> One advantage of metal, it actually has a bead, unlike paper faced. I find that paper faced beads, you have to sand it to a point. The metal takes care of that for you.
> 
> Any overspill on metal, you can just skim off with your knife/trowel, on paper you end up taking mud off the other side.
> 
> ...


Paper faced metal has a bead more in line with regular metal but slightly less pronounced.

Plastic extruded, such as No-coat, is sharper but has the advantage of sitting lower to the Sheetrock which ( as mentioned )helps quite a bit on compound use but also helps in keeping the trim-work straight along the walls. ( brings up a question about plaster mesh )***

I did a 28,000 bf house at the beginning of the year and used 3.75" Auto-flex ( first job using this product ) and glad I did, as every bit of the wood in the house was stained....no caulk at all. I ended up using 1,500 ft of this stuff an still ran short of roughly '200 

** the plaster bead that I'm used to has the triangle pattern but I'm assuming that all PB has a higher lip due the whole wall build-up of the product. So...if using for drywall where you only cover about 12" + or - of the board ...and even if it appears full when gauging with your knife or trowel, I would suspect that spanning a longer distance with a straight edge would show a larger gap than regular bead or extruded. Have you guys that use this method noticed any problems where crown, chair rail or base meet?


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

DLSdrywall said:


> Actually metal beads are all we use. Guys usually nail them in. I personally get my compressor and stapler and staple my beads much faster. I stagger my staples to minimize buckling because the framming is usually chit! Pre-cut everything then go nuts installing. On side jobs i use vinyl i hate paper faced beads no offense.:blink:


I also use the compressor and stapler on big jobs only and little jobs the trim tex and stapler work great ...I am thinking about trying a 
*Bostitch 16 Gauge 1-in Wide Crown 2-in Lathing Stapler 450S2-1-R*


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

I primarily use metal bead, and like you carpentaper I mesh/hotmud it.

The one difference I see between my method and the ones posted is that I hit the middle first, but then I jump to the ends. I push it pretty damn tight in the middle and ends, and then the pressure required for the rest of it is minimal. If the framing/hanging is decent, it usually comes out just right. Like 2Buck said, I use the holes as a guide as to how tight I am, but I'm not religious about allowing no airspace.....whatever it takes to get it so the edges aren't proud of the bead line. I won't say that I like it loose, because I don't but it's better to have a little bit of extra fill for strength. I can almost always get away with two coats when using a hot mud base coat.

Here's a somewhat funny story (because I feel like typing):

I was working a big commercial L5 job, and I had been running bead for a couple of days, hot mud first coat, light topping skim. I came back to the area I was working and saw the foreman putting a 3rd coat on my beads with a 14" knife. I yelled at him and said "What the f*** are you doing?! Those are done!" I took him over to a bead that he hadn't coated yet and laid a 16" trowel across it and it was _flat_. Then we went over to his bead and laid the trowel and the blade sunk 1/8" into his fresh mud. He had humped out a fair number of my beads. He was so used to 3rd coating everything that he didn't even check first.....and he certainly wasn't applying what we call a pi$$ coat (super thin just to fill in any shrinkage lines). Yeah.....that guy wasn't qualified to be a taping foreman, and I was thrilled when I got to leave that nightmare job.:thumbsup:


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## DLSdrywall (May 22, 2012)

SlimPickins said:


> I primarily use metal bead, and like you carpentaper I mesh/hotmud it.
> 
> The one difference I see between my method and the ones posted is that I hit the middle first, but then I jump to the ends. I push it pretty damn tight in the middle and ends, and then the pressure required for the rest of it is minimal. If the framing/hanging is decent, it usually comes out just right. Like 2Buck said, I use the holes as a guide as to how tight I am, but I'm not religious about allowing no airspace.....whatever it takes to get it so the edges aren't proud of the bead line. I won't say that I like it loose, because I don't but it's better to have a little bit of extra fill for strength. I can almost always get away with two coats when using a hot mud base coat.
> 
> ...


I mesh and hot mud beads that have a lot of fill to prevent cracking when the house has settled.:thumbup:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

DLSdrywall said:


> I mesh and hot mud beads that have a lot of fill to prevent cracking when the house has settled.:thumbup:


Don't the rockers install the bead for you:blink:
Thought the rule was, if the bead required a hammer or any pneumatic tool to install, the carpenter/drywaller had to install. Where as a bead requiring mud/glue the taper installed........ Union rules:whistling2:

Now I half to get up to the GTA area, to show you the zook and paper bead:thumbup:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

fr8train said:


> One advantage of metal, it actually has a bead, unlike paper faced. I find that paper faced beads, you have to sand it to a point. The metal takes care of that for you.
> 
> Any overspill on metal, you can just skim off with your knife/trowel, on paper you end up taking mud off the other side.
> 
> ...


Which type of paper bead?????
Just wondering, we have 2 types, maybe you have the same???

We have B1U, metal is equal in size on each side of nosing, nosing is larger also. (I prefer B1U's)

Then there's B1W, one side of metal is larger than the other side (you half to think, when installing), and the nosing is smaller.


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## icerock drywall (Nov 13, 2010)

I dont think I have used a drywall nail in 15 years


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

icerock drywall said:


> I dont think I have used a drywall nail in 15 years


I used them the other day.....to nail Ice & Water along the bottom of a house :laughing:


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## DLSdrywall (May 22, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> Don't the rockers install the bead for you:blink:
> Thought the rule was, if the bead required a hammer or any pneumatic tool to install, the carpenter/drywaller had to install. Where as a bead requiring mud/glue the taper installed........ Union rules:whistling2:
> 
> Now I half to get up to the GTA area, to show you the zook and paper bead:thumbup:


ya i dont install anything but no coat, the 45's that only have backing on the one side i put mesh and hot mud so it dosen't crack. I hate paper beads if the framming sucks the paper bead buckles. I'd love to learn the zook, it gets to the point where i hate taping lol. Maybe i could come up there for a week, show me your dope glencoe style lol:yes:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

DLSdrywall said:


> ya i dont install anything but no coat, the 45's that only have backing on the one side i put mesh and hot mud so it dosen't crack. I hate paper beads if the framming sucks the paper bead buckles. I'd love to learn the zook, it gets to the point where i hate taping lol. Maybe i could come up there for a week, show me your dope glencoe style lol:yes:


But there's more to do fun wise where you live
You might half to swing our way, I guess were taping out a 16 story high rise this winter. It easier to schedule something out compared to shacks. You might even get to work before us, considering we start at 10 or 11:whistling2:

You could always crash at 2bjr's for the night too, at least he lives in London where there's something to see and do. Unless you like sheep and cows, then you can come out to Glencoe:thumbup:


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

i've been doing so many one day jobs lately that when i get to use steel it is easier. sometimes i have to use paper if the framing is to random to fasten to. it can be hard to be gentle on paper beads when scraping down a coat of hotmud and i also hate having to mix a batch just to install beads. i'm starting to get a good two coat system going for thes little one day jobs. restaurant fronts and patch jobs. all little emergency no notice jobs not requiring a perfect finish. flat black ceilings. its kind of nice to let the standards drop sometimes. i've also been doing a couple of rental units one coat three ways, pin holes oh well.


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