# box repair



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

my 12" box at #5 runs at too high of a arch ,I'm guessing you half to back off the nuts on the pins where the springs are, but how many turns at a time,1,2,3,4 turns,are they really touchy.or am I going about this wrong.
it's a north star.
I got one 10" box that is real bad,barely loads.
got 2 - 12" boxes,and 2 10" boxes,may want to fine turn them all when things get slow.
and not talking blades ,shoes,etc.....30 years experience here,just not the mechanical type that's all......and our repair guy sucks in our area ,he puts the parts on,then we fix them


----------



## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> my 12" box at #5 runs at too high of a arch ,I'm guessing you half to back off the nuts on the pins where the springs are, but how many turns at a time,1,2,3,4 turns,are they really touchy.or am I going about this wrong.
> it's a north star.
> I got one 10" box that is real bad,barely loads.
> got 2 - 12" boxes,and 2 10" boxes,may want to fine turn them all when things get slow.
> and not talking blades ,shoes,etc.....30 years experience here,just not the mechanical type that's all......and our repair guy sucks in our area ,he puts the parts on,then we fix them


 No rocket surgeon here, but I think you are fretting too much.

LOOK at it, hold it where you can SEE the bow, then turn the bolts down till they look better to you. If you can SEE it, you can FIX it.

What have you got to loose??? You can always turn em back !!!!

What I'm trying to say is,,, it is not that big a deal, just GO FOR IT !!!!!!!!!


----------



## ColumbiaTechSupport (Aug 13, 2010)

Turn the nuts down if you want more mud and up if you want less mud. Like Capt said it doesn't matter how much or how little you do, it's an experiment to get the feel you like. I suggest having the tools on the jobsite to adjust if it doesn't feel right.


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

yeah I know I'm fretting a bit ,just in my newbie days ,guy who taught me ,said to never mess with the pins,but now that I'm older and MAYBE wiser ???? seeing he was wrong.
my 12" at #5 skims nice and tight in the middle,but leaves a edge .At #4 it leaves no edge,but starts to load a bit through the middle.....the Goldy locks theory strikes !!!!
sent my one 10" to get rebuilt,lets just say it makes a good skimming box the way it's set up.
guess my question is, does one or two turns make a drastic change on the brass bracket thingy .or do you half to give them alot of turns to notice a change in amount of mud flow.don't want to spend half the day f*cking with it.Or box out half a house before I get it right.
guessing with the north stars the middle pin is the most important one to adjust too ??????


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Hi 2buck, I adjust my tapetach easy cleans as i need, you can get your boxes to run sweet on one job but then on the next the mud may be slighty different or thinner or thicker than the last job so your 4 or 5 dial may coat a little different so then needs the pins turned to suit, just give em one or two turns in or out as you think it might need to get em coating as you want, I dont know if this is standard practice or if others do this??? but it suits me anyway.


----------



## proficient Mudder (Aug 28, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> yeah I know I'm fretting a bit ,just in my newbie days ,guy who taught me ,said to never mess with the pins,but now that I'm older and MAYBE wiser ???? seeing he was wrong.
> my 12" at #5 skims nice and tight in the middle,but leaves a edge .At #4 it leaves no edge,but starts to load a bit through the middle.....the Goldy locks theory strikes !!!!
> sent my one 10" to get rebuilt,lets just say it makes a good skimming box the way it's set up.
> guess my question is, does one or two turns make a drastic change on the brass bracket thingy .or do you half to give them alot of turns to notice a change in amount of mud flow.don't want to spend half the day f*cking with it.Or box out half a house before I get it right.
> guessing with the north stars the middle pin is the most important one to adjust too ??????


Being most of all box bridges as i call them are arched differently than being on the job and adjusting is about the only way to feel comfortable with mud flow.

Looking at the difference in tension on the 12" box between dial 4 and 5 setting, you can adjust out the tension between the numbers without much thread difference. Just keep them pretty much the same on turns on both sides, where probably the northstar has the center adjustment simplifying this step.

Bill


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

ok thank you cazna and proficient mudder
just one or 2 turns at a time makes a difference,will save me some time now,will be testing in a garage today.thanks


----------



## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

cazna said:


> Hi 2buck, I adjust my tapetach easy cleans as i need, you can get your boxes to run sweet on one job but then on the next the mud may be slighty different or thinner or thicker than the last job so your 4 or 5 dial may coat a little different so then needs the pins turned to suit, just give em one or two turns in or out as you think it might need to get em coating as you want, I dont know if this is standard practice or if others do this??? but it suits me anyway.


Excellent reply,,, we use these tools to make our living. We SHOULD take the time to LEARN how to adjust them. If we don't or won't ,,,,,then its shame on us....... Or as my G'Pa used to say,,,,, "cry me a handfull"


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> I got one 10" box that is real bad,barely loads.


Just a thought on this: The other week I was looking at the blades on a couple of older Tape Techs. Even on a 0 setting, a 12" was bowed out like it was already on a 5 setting, and even worse. Could it be that something like the blade holder - the copper looking thing the blade sits in - might have distorted enough that it's causing you such problems? &/or could the blade itself need some bending (or replacing) to help conform to the shape it should be? Is there any chance the blade could've once been pulled out and then put in backwards to whatever bend it had? Did maybe at some point some mud or something get between the blade and its holder, and is keeping the center of the blade pushed out?

-----

Question for Aaron, about Columbia box blade bending: If I want to put more bend into my blade (&/or blade holder) when it's at a 0 setting, for say putting a little more mud on top of tapes when straddling/coating them with a box (without running the tape sides 1st and using that buildup to give more height), is there a 'best procedure' for that kind of bending?


----------



## proficient Mudder (Aug 28, 2010)

JustMe said:


> -----
> 
> Question for Aaron, about Columbia box blade bending: If I want to put more bend into my blade (&/or blade holder) when it's at a 0 setting, for say putting a little more mud on top of tapes when straddling/coating them with a box (without running the tape sides 1st and using that buildup to give more height), is there a 'best procedure' for that kind of bending?


I am not Aaron and sorry for interferring with the question, but Why would you want height on something that needs to be flat? forgive me, if i misunderstood.

Bill


----------



## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

with the blade in your hand hold it with both hands and run it back and forth lightly over the corner of a table or bench or 2x4 giving it a slight bend[I used to do that to my trowels once a year] now thats how you treat a warn out blade JMO


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

proficient Mudder said:


> I am not Aaron and sorry for interferring with the question, but Why would you want height on something that needs to be flat? forgive me, if i misunderstood.
> 
> Bill


mud shrinks,for example,we use a curve trowel to first coat bead ,it puts on more than a level coat,next day when its dry it shrinks back to level,then skim coat,thats one trick to get 2 coat bead.with some of these new beads,vinyl or ultraflex ,you can run boxes down them,so the higher the arch you can get on your box to coat your bead......:yes:


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

proficient Mudder said:


> I am not Aaron and sorry for interferring with the question, but Why would you want height on something that needs to be flat? forgive me, if i misunderstood.
> 
> Bill


No problem, Bill. It's a fair question, and one that I thought might come up.

My newer Columbia boxes don't really have this problem (although I'm not sure yet how well they're going to consistently handle the boxing on top of FibaFuse, with such things as tape threads seeming to stick up at times, especially if I box butt joint sides 1st and the blade starts pulling up/out tape threads. I'm thinking I might want to switch to boxing the middle 1st, and then the sides. because of the fiber tearing issue. Fiba did micrometer out at over 10 thou thickness in spots, when I checked it. Don't know how well those spots will box, if I go down the middle 1st. Other tapers in our company - the ones who do box butts at times, and are starting to use FibaFuse at times - might want to do the same as well, and the curve in many of their box blades might not/won't do it. And if there is a high butt joint, I could see some tearing/cutting of the FibaFuse along that seam. Maybe just stick to paper on the butt joints? Would be a bit of a shame. I do like the way Fiba goes on, wipes out, lays down).

There is a nice enough curve in the blades of the boxes I have right now, for boxing over butt type tapes which don't have mud built up on the sides. Some of the older Columbia boxes that the company I'm working for owns, don't sometimes have that curve so much. At least not anymore. Their one remaining 12" Tape Tech that I'd mentioned sure doesn't. 

Trying to cover some paper tapes with some of the boxes often didn't leave enough on top of the tape to really work with, if you went down the middle 1st. Some of those boxes I'd like to set up better for some of the other tapers, so they can use it like that at times where wanted.

One example: I had a basically 8' vertical butt type joint on my current job, which was close to a wall too much to box well on both sides, and then later down the middle. There was another 4' bottom butt joint close by - a seeming somewhat strange setup to me, but it happened. Because my boxes have a good enough curve, I could box over top of the 8' and box the sides of the 4', later box on top of the 4' and one side of the 8', and later finish 2nd coating everything by hand, tying it all in nicely to each other and the corner. It went faster, better, than my doing it all by hand only.

And some of the tapers don't like boxing the sides of a butt joint, then the top, then skimming it all out after. They won't box the sides and skim the center, either, as a 1st coat. If they could just box over the butt joint well enough after finishing taping, and finish it off after with a knife, they might do it. Some don't have enough knife control to consistently leave enough on the tape with the 1st coat, and it can be a problem for 2nd coating and checkout.

Hope that all made enough sense.


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

DSJOHN said:


> with the blade in your hand hold it with both hands and run it back and forth lightly over the corner of a table or bench or 2x4 giving it a slight bend[I used to do that to my trowels once a year] now thats how you treat a warn out blade JMO


after time ,the blade will just conform back to the position of the brass housing,adjusting the pins is what adjust arch,never had a problem with my boxes till I sent them into get rebuilt,guess I should of mailed them to Columbia to get rebuilt:whistling2:


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

just me
boxes run true,if you box over something and the tape shows...you build it wider not out more,not all butts created equal,theres always one or two butts that require more attention than the others.I personally don't run boxes wide open on butts,what ever # I run my flats at ,I use the same # on my butts,I see a lot of tapers with humped butts so.....build wider not out:yes:


----------



## proficient Mudder (Aug 28, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> just me
> boxes run true,if you box over something and the tape shows...you build it wider not out more,not all butts created equal,theres always one or two butts that require more attention than the others.I personally don't run boxes wide open on butts,what ever # I run my flats at ,I use the same # on my butts,I see a lot of tapers with humped butts so.....build wider not out:yes:


 
Absolutely,
that's why I had asked (justme) my previous question about why he would want to buildup something up that needs to be flat. 

I like to type, but sometimes it's easier just to agree with a quote.

Bill


----------



## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> just me
> boxes run true,if you box over something and the tape shows...you build it wider not out more,not all butts created equal,theres always one or two butts that require more attention than the others.I personally don't run boxes wide open on butts,what ever # I run my flats at ,I use the same # on my butts,I see a lot of tapers with humped butts so.....build wider not out:yes:


 Well said,,, some drywall these days have "high shoulders", a box can't fix bad drywall, you just have to go around and fix these spots by hand, between coats.

In other words, opening up your box and laying a "humped" joint, won't fix a bad piece of rock.


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> just me
> boxes run true,if you box over something and the tape shows...you build it wider not out more,not all butts created equal,theres always one or two butts that require more attention than the others.I personally don't run boxes wide open on butts,what ever # I run my flats at ,I use the same # on my butts,I see a lot of tapers with humped butts so.....build wider not out:yes:


THx, 2buck.

If you don't run the sides of a butt 1st, and instead run it wide open up the middle with the curve that the blades on some boxes have, then there still isn't enough blade height to cover the tape on even a tight butt. That was (supposed to be) my main point - that the blades seem to have gone to being too flat on some of the boxes my company has, and need some curve put back in them, to get them to operate as were meant to.

Good point about the raised butts. I do fix them when noticed, especially those that are bad enough to cause enough of a problem - makes more sense than spending so much extra time and mud trying to disappear them.

The humped butts thing I see a lot around here from those not running enough mud flat enough up the middle, instead running the sides too much and leaving a more pointed high spot in the middle. Even with butts that end up wide, that can show. Hard to sand the center down flat enough, well enough.

After running the sides of a butt with a 12", I do a tight middle with a 12. Then skim by hand, making it wider while feathering. I haven't had a butt showing problem for awhile doing that.


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

well,i hope this post explains then,that if you want to drastically change the mud flow of your box ,adjust the pins.I was reading another pro drywall talk site from Europe, I fell out of my chair laughing,they didn't even know you could adjust the blades.
And cazna,don't mean to pick on you,but I don't think adjusting the pins all the time is the norm.....I could be wrong...but


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

I wouldnt say i do it all the time, just when i start to run it on the first few joins and im not happy with the setting i just give em a turn or two to suit, isnt it the mud thinkness pushing back on the blade is what controls how much load and crown is set on the blade?? this varys from bucket to bucket and job to job depending on how much you thin it as well so a turn or two fixes this as i go, Oh well:blink: works for me :thumbsup:


----------



## proficient Mudder (Aug 28, 2010)

cazna said:


> I wouldnt say i do it all the time, just when i start to run it on the first few joins and im not happy with the setting i just give em a turn or two to suit, isnt it the mud thinkness pushing back on the blade is what controls how much load and crown is set on the blade?? this varys from bucket to bucket and job to job depending on how much you thin it as well so a turn or two fixes this as i go, Oh well:blink: works for me :thumbsup:


No disrespect here either,just trying to help. but until you all start screwing the board to the studs to set the glue evenly, your going to always fight offset board and high shoulders.
JMO, Bill


----------



## ColumbiaTechSupport (Aug 13, 2010)

Question for Aaron, about Columbia box blade bending: If I want to put more bend into my blade (&/or blade holder) when it's at a 0 setting, for say putting a little more mud on top of tapes when straddling/coating them with a box (without running the tape sides 1st and using that buildup to give more height), is there a 'best procedure' for that kind of bending?[/QUOTE]

The procedure that I use is to hold the box by the sides and run the blade lengthwise from shoe to shoe on the corner of a table (I use a 2x4 that is attached to the table to not damage the table). When you have done this put the box down onto a flat surface to check how much arch you have.


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

A 2X4 and a table. THat's a 'best procedure' I can do. THx, Aaron.


----------



## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

ColumbiaTechSupport said:


> Question for Aaron, about Columbia box blade bending: If I want to put more bend into my blade (&/or blade holder) when it's at a 0 setting, for say putting a little more mud on top of tapes when straddling/coating them with a box (without running the tape sides 1st and using that buildup to give more height), is there a 'best procedure' for that kind of bending?


The procedure that I use is to hold the box by the sides and run the blade lengthwise from shoe to shoe on the corner of a table (I use a 2x4 that is attached to the table to not damage the table). When you have done this put the box down onto a flat surface to check how much arch you have.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for posting this,,I think some here thought I was joking when I posted how I do it,,its not rocket science,but sometimes feels like it!!


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

DSJOHN said:


> Thanks for posting this,,I think some here thought I was joking when I posted how I do it,,its not rocket science,but sometimes feels like it!!


For some reason I missed reading your previous post. But thanks, DSJ, for that.

And when it comes to knowing EXactly what should be done - about EVerything - we are ALL rocket scientists.


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

dsjohn

Thanks for posting this,,I think some here thought I was joking when I posted how I do it,,its not rocket science,but sometimes feels like it!![/QUOTE]

that was me,but you stated holding the blade in your hand,not the whole box,so I still get 1/2 a point ,for I stated it would just conform back to the brass housing.If you meant the whole box then sorry........but read your post???
In some way it is rocket science ,you think that would be something you do out of anger !!!!! 
guess I got to try this now to my one 10" box that dont load now.
I do this to my pole sanding heads,they warp over time too


----------



## DSJOHN (Apr 5, 2010)

:thumbup:


JustMe said:


> For some reason I missed reading your previous post. But thanks, DSJ, for that.
> 
> And when it comes to knowing EXactly what should be done - about EVerything - we are ALL rocket scientists.


The more I think about it ,its actually not so easy,after 32 years now it seems easy but when I think back a bit there is quite a learning curve in this business ,kinda fun when you stick the tools in your hands out toward the GC or HO and say"go ahead give it a try" we all make it look so easy because we,re skilled,but grossly underappreciated


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

DSJOHN said:


> we all make it look so easy because we,re skilled,but grossly underappreciated


I told a carpenter and electrician today that I'm not into construction. I'm into art. They laughed. Maybe with me.

Google Images | Drywall Artwork: http://www.google.ca/images?hl=en&b...esult_group&ct=title&resnum=4&ved=0CDMQsAQwAw


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

proficient Mudder said:


> No disrespect here either,just trying to help. but until you all start screwing the board to the studs to set the glue evenly, your going to always fight offset board and high shoulders.
> JMO, Bill


 
No disrespect taken bill, your right and correct, but i dont put the board up and its industry standard so thats what we get.


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

time to wear 2 hats cazna,you may as while start hanging the drywall too,here's all you need to know,the white side goes out:jester:


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Oh well that sounds too easy then, Feeling a bit pissed about the whole industry at the moment, that house i posted about Windows/Doors, Well the owners put such a rush on it to hurry up and move in, then proceeded to cook the life out of it with hot water under floor heating, Well its only taken 3months to start shrinking the joins and peaking the screws, Rush rush rush when it was built hurry hurry hurry were moving in said the owners, now they want to know why the walls are playing up, Any [email protected]#$ing wonder, built fast, no heaters or dehumids, sh!T timber, Sh!t wallboard, USG your [email protected]#&ng taping compound and total keeps shrinking like hell, [email protected]#K This sh!t, doing the best i can and even skimming everything and this crap happens, You try to speak out as you go about what could happen but everyone else thinks your being over paranoid and silly and makes a joke out of it, So now its seems i have to put this info in with quotes right at the start to cover my arse, [email protected]# these big desiged [email protected] houses, give me smaller easier ones please.

That my rant, dont feel much better about it though, Any helpful advice would be good and Mudstar!!! dont you start your patronising nonsence.


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

cazna said:


> Any helpful advice would be good


I'd want to have a possible viable alternative to offer in my quotes.

How about maybe trying to offer Vario? Scare the owners with an explanation and pics of what can happen with regular muds; mention about this imported from Germany product - that's proven itself for 25 years - being availabe through you; add an extra charge for it; and if they opt for the cheaper option, and something does happen, you can say that you offered a better choice.


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

get them to sign something in writing that you will continue to push forward to complete their house,but under duress ,due to the environment and conditions you must work under.when people are asked to put their name to something ,they tend to listen more,and if not,you can remind them how you wanted them to sign.......blah blah blah .....and go told you so !
it will give you peace of mind:thumbsup:


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

If you state limitations in your quote without offering an alternative, and competitors don't state the same limitations in their's, it can often cause a customer to more so consider choosing your competitor.

Friend just told me a story about this happening to him, on some condo concrete repairs.

One way he got around it was to tell the condo owners to ask the competition how they were planning on fixing X, Y and Z. He made the competition look a little like they didn't fully know what they were doing, and ended up with the job.


----------



## proficient Mudder (Aug 28, 2010)

Maybe you can use part of this link i pasted and show it for recomended warranty conditions. 
I always show the material warranty restrictions to the owners under certain weather conditions and also include info about wood framing curing time for the homeowners or builders to understand that it's there responsibilty to maintain the guidelines of material warranties and it's my responsibility to warranty my labor.

Bill

http://www.gypsum.org/pdf/236-2000b.pdf


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

nice little link p.m.
but be a sneaky little bitch cazna.Don't tell them the environmental conditions you expect till after you get the job.Most people don't tell you their in a rush till after you start,so fair is fair:thumbsup:


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> get them to sign something in writing that you will continue to push forward to complete their house,but under duress ,due to the environment and conditions you must work under.when people are asked to put their name to something ,they tend to listen more,and if not,you can remind them how you wanted them to sign.......blah blah blah .....and go told you so !
> it will give you peace of mind:thumbsup:


 
Thats a brillent idea i should have done that, I was going to do one coat inside then one outside on the eves then one inside then outside, and so on and so on but i just started the out side coat after taping up the inside and the HO demanded i get inside finished first, I should have made him sign something then, the push was rediculas, And i knew it could turn bad, but i didnt realise how bad it can get. House building is having a big change around here in nz, or maybe we are just catching up to what the rest of the world has to offer.

I would love to give vario a go but we dont have it here? are you telling me its a setting mud that has low shrinkage justme??? 
Any low shrinkage mud would be a dream come true.

Cheers for that link bill, here is one that im using as well http://www.drywalldirect.co.nz/Drywall-Direct/Technical-Info.php

I am going to build a new house in a few years so im thinking of steel frame which is only just starting to come in here, been around a while but very few people used it. 

Thank you for your input, i now have a few more ways to handle this problem that i didnt think of, Cheers guys. :thumbsup:


----------



## Kiwiman (Jun 14, 2008)

I feel your pain Caz :wallbash:. Have you had any experience with the usg total (black lid) showing after the paint settles, what I mean is that after you're positive the job is sanded to perfection under a 500w halogen then the topcoat seems to shrink back after a couple of weeks so the edge of the plaster looks un-sanded but is only visible under strong glancing light, I'm wondering if it's the paint staying wetter for longer during the colder months and in some way re activating or swelling the mud or wallboard (hard to explain). It's not something the average joe bloggs would notice but is still an acceptable level 4 finish.


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

cazna said:


> I would love to give vario a go but we dont have it here? are you telling me its a setting mud that has low shrinkage justme???
> Any low shrinkage mud would be a dream come true.


It does say on their site *extremely low shrinkage. *

We don't have it up here in Canada, either, although they're supposed to be trying to line up a distributor. Rebel is getting them to send us a bag to try. If it's anything like is said, and with a 120 minute mix coming online as well, I'll be suggesting that all the branches consider getting some.

If NZ doesn't have it, maybe you could look into getting some shipped in? If others are having the same problem, it could give you an advantage, if you can offer it and others can't? Maybe become NZ distributor for it?


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Kiwiman said:


> I feel your pain Caz :wallbash:. Have you had any experience with the usg total (black lid) showing after the paint settles, what I mean is that after you're positive the job is sanded to perfection under a 500w halogen then the topcoat seems to shrink back after a couple of weeks so the edge of the plaster looks un-sanded but is only visible under strong glancing light, I'm wondering if it's the paint staying wetter for longer during the colder months and in some way re activating or swelling the mud or wallboard (hard to explain). It's not something the average joe bloggs would notice but is still an acceptable level 4 finish.


Havent noticed that kiwiman, this is worse, bad shrinkage, one area above a gas fire with a tv set into the wall, you wouldnt believe how much its shrunk back, i gave it 6 coats over as much time as i could, i was sure it was done drying but its actually pulled back so far you can see the paper/metel trim edges, i reckon it would take 3 more coats to bring it up again, its just incredable, but that spot has under floor heating, a gas fire fire and the heat off a tv getting to it, I never noticed this much shrinkage when i was using tradeset by hand then one coat of plus 4, but the houses didnt have this nasty underfloor heating and were not as big either, Sorry to go off track, this is a box repair tread but god i need some help with this, i went autotools but then i need to use air drying mud for taping, but some say chemical setting shrinks more than air????? WTF


----------



## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

cazna,you sound like a super guy,but I think I know why you piss off mudstar,I don't drink but tonight i had some ,so here we go
-find a system and stick to it,change the system if you must....but you know blah blah blah.
do things by hand,back in the day ...we were taught to do all things by hand,apply tape.coat ,sand etc.....machines did not make us better,they made us more productive ,get back to basics
to me,take away all the toys,give me just hand toys,no machines,and my work will pass,I may not make as much money...but....it's like give a guy a big d!ck and he thinks he's a great lover,but do you kiss good....like i said i may regret what i type right now but gee....guys go buy all these tools and they think their a taper....it's progression ,learn to do by hand first,then get machines.sorry to say but this trade takes talent,artistic flare,some people can sing ,some can't,and this may sound crazy ,but I find most of the best tapers i know are intelligent and smart savie type guys ,could of been doctor /lawyer type guys,but they chose to work with their hands.I like this site ,but man,if you need to get your bazooka fixed ,then this is the site,but to get your work to pass ,that's in your heart
P.S thank god for spell check,and the leafs are winning a hockey game 2 to 1,must be drunk


----------



## proficient Mudder (Aug 28, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> cazna,you sound like a super guy,but I think I know why you piss off mudstar,I don't drink but tonight i had some ,so here we go
> -find a system and stick to it,change the system if you must....but you know blah blah blah.
> do things by hand,back in the day ...we were taught to do all things by hand,apply tape.coat ,sand etc.....machines did not make us better,they made us more productive ,get back to basics
> to me,take away all the toys,give me just hand toys,no machines,and my work will pass,I may not make as much money...but....it's like give a guy a big d!ck and he thinks he's a great lover,but do you kiss good....like i said i may regret what i type right now but gee....guys go buy all these tools and they think their a taper....it's progression ,learn to do by hand first,then get machines.sorry to say but this trade takes talent,artistic flare,some people can sing ,some can't,and this may sound crazy ,but I find most of the best tapers i know are intelligent and smart savie type guys ,could of been doctor /lawyer type guys,but they chose to work with their hands.I like this site ,but man,if you need to get your bazooka fixed ,then this is the site,but to get your work to pass ,that's in your heart
> P.S thank god for spell check,and the leafs are winning a hockey game 2 to 1,must be drunk


 
Spoken from a true professional.
Let me buy you a drink,:drink: 
Bill


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> cazna,you sound like a super guy,but I think I know why you piss off mudstar,I don't drink but tonight i had some ,so here we go
> -find a system and stick to it,change the system if you must....but you know blah blah blah.
> do things by hand,back in the day ...we were taught to do all things by hand,apply tape.coat ,sand etc.....machines did not make us better,they made us more productive ,get back to basics
> to me,take away all the toys,give me just hand toys,no machines,and my work will pass,I may not make as much money...but....it's like give a guy a big d!ck and he thinks he's a great lover,but do you kiss good....like i said i may regret what i type right now but gee....guys go buy all these tools and they think their a taper....it's progression ,learn to do by hand first,then get machines.sorry to say but this trade takes talent,artistic flare,some people can sing ,some can't,and this may sound crazy ,but I find most of the best tapers i know are intelligent and smart savie type guys ,could of been doctor /lawyer type guys,but they chose to work with their hands.I like this site ,but man,if you need to get your bazooka fixed ,then this is the site,but to get your work to pass ,that's in your heart
> P.S thank god for spell check,and the leafs are winning a hockey game 2 to 1,must be drunk


 
You are drunk 2 buck and typing a heap of judgemental crap, whats all that rambling about systems and tools got to do with me saying i have had some bad shrinkage, Cheers for the support and advice, I did it by hand for 10 years, And just how do you know if your running the right system and tools if you dont compare and chat with others or are you the same as mudstar and was born with a full working knowledge of all things drywall, Must be great to be god.


----------

