# ultralight jointing



## jfscotti (Jul 10, 2011)

USG, Ultralight Sheetrock

We just completed a 100 sheet job in an air conditioned basement. Used fiberglass tape at the 12" spacer placed mid wall. The joint cracked and we had to cut and rejoint the entire job. We had used a joint compound throughout. On the second attempt we grooved the old joints and filled with Durobond followed with paper tape then two passes of Durobond and a finish coat of joint compound. So far it looks good and we will paint tomorrow. Anyone had a similar experience??? I think the board moved after jointing due to moisture expansion. Please share your opinion and experience. Thanks


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

jfscotti said:


> USG, Ultralight Sheetrock
> 
> We just completed a 100 sheet job in an air conditioned basement. Used fiberglass tape at the 12" spacer placed mid wall. The joint cracked and we had to cut and rejoint the entire job. We had used a joint compound throughout. On the second attempt we grooved the old joints and filled with Durobond followed with paper tape then two passes of Durobond and a finish coat of joint compound. So far it looks good and we will paint tomorrow. Anyone had a similar experience??? I think the board moved after jointing due to moisture expansion. Please share your opinion and experience. Thanks


 I think you'll find that it cracked cause you used mesh tape the first time.

Not saying anything bad about mesh tape,, but it will crack,everytime

Some people like to use mesh tape, but then they wonder why it cracks, everytime

I have noticed that people that like mesh tape, are eager to report that the manufactors of mesh tape state that it won't crack, but then seek answers to why the job that they meshed taped ended up cracking

Then again,,,, well nevemind


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

jfscotti said:


> USG, Ultralight Sheetrock
> 
> We just completed a 100 sheet job in an air conditioned basement. Used fiberglass tape at the 12" spacer placed mid wall. The joint cracked and we had to cut and rejoint the entire job. We had used a joint compound throughout. On the second attempt we grooved the old joints and filled with Durobond followed with paper tape then two passes of Durobond and a finish coat of joint compound. So far it looks good and we will paint tomorrow. Anyone had a similar experience??? I think the board moved after jointing due to moisture expansion. Please share your opinion and experience. Thanks


Your post screams non-professional taper:yes:

The Captain is going easy on you, he must of switched his beer brand

Here's your answer MESH TAPE SUCKS !!!!!!!


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## sdrdrywall (Sep 4, 2010)

Feeling fiesty 2 buck


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

sdrdrywall said:


> Feeling fiesty 2 buck


 he's just pissed cause the porta potty ran out of paper and he had to use mesh tape !!!


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> he's just pissed cause the porta potty ran out of paper and he had to use mesh tape !!!


That's about all mesh tape is good for,,,,,and even then, it doesn't work well enough on that crack either:blink:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Using mesh tape helps you stay in the air conditioned basement twice as long. That is the ONLY good thing about mesh tape!


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## sdrdrywall (Sep 4, 2010)

Well at least you know if you use it for that it will fall off sooner or later !:blink:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

We have used about a thousand sheets of the Ultra Light rock and no trouble. But we use either paper or Fibafuse tape. No mesh user here. That stuff cracks every time... Every time..... yep, every time. See for yourself.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> he's just pissed cause the porta potty ran out of paper and he had to use mesh tape !!!


:lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Notice jfscotti posted once and ran as fast as a rabbit? He's long gone. Don't think he got the answer he was looking for.


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

Just in case he didnt get it. Mesh tape is crap.:thumbdown::thumbdown:
I have a role it last forever someone gave it to me 5 years ago and it is still going.


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Mesh is for fools.....and they will rush in.


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## Final touch drywall (Mar 30, 2010)

still waiting>>>>:whistling2::whistling2:


still waiting>>>>:whistling2::whistling2:


When do the cracks start again>>>when used properly.


still waiting>>>:whistling2:

Nuff said.


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## Final touch drywall (Mar 30, 2010)

jfscotti said:


> USG, Ultralight Sheetrock
> 
> We had used a joint compound throughout.


^^^^^here's your problem.^^^^^^


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## Final touch drywall (Mar 30, 2010)

cazna said:


> Mesh is for fools.....and they will rush in.


Call me a fool,but my entire body thanks me every day.

You gotta love the responses,coming from guys that never use it. I was a fool for not switching over sooner and for listening to the fools who thinks mesh is'nt strong. Put mesh and setting compound together and its like concrete on your walls.


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

Final touch drywall said:


> Call me a fool,but my entire body thanks me every day.
> 
> You gotta love the responses,coming from guys that never use it. I was a fool for not switching over sooner and for listening to the fools who thinks mesh is'nt strong. Put mesh and setting compound together and its like concrete on your walls.


So if mesh tape is so good that must mean that you use it for angles to eh


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

Mesh tape cracks? :confused1:
























Oh.....I see, he went and used regular mud! Blaming the Ultra-light sheetrock is more than likely barking up the wrong giraffe........


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Final touch drywall said:


> Call me a fool,but my entire body thanks me every day.
> 
> You gotta love the responses,coming from guys that never use it. I was a fool for not switching over sooner and for listening to the fools who thinks mesh is'nt strong. Put mesh and setting compound together and its like concrete on your walls.


 Using mesh with ap will crack,, using it with setting mud won't crack,,, lets carry this ONE step further,,,, using setting mud WITHOUT any tape don't crack either. So you can rave all ya want to bout mesh,,, it ain't the mesh, its the setting compound.

Try this,,, hang two pieces of dura-rock,, mesh tape it,,, cover it with synthetic stucco(drivet, sto,whatever), but wait, not that bold??? cover it with thin-set,,, come back tomarrow,,,,, its cracked.

I am not one of them guys that have never used it,, I'm one of them guys that tried it in every situation and realized that it cracks,,,,,everytime,, cept when you use setting compound,,, in which case it is not needed.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

I used mesh ONCE. Applied with hot mud . It cracked within 3 weeks.
All of it. 

That was enough for me. 

90 percent of us can't be wrong.:whistling2: If it were 50/50 ,well that would be a different story.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

moore said:


> I used mesh ONCE. Applied with hot mud . It cracked within 3 weeks.
> All of it.
> 
> That was enough for me.
> ...


 Thats really the crux of the matter,,,,, when you use it, and it cracks on ya,,, its like an ex-wife that cheated on ya,,,, can't never trust it again


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Good one, Capt. I've tried mesh with Easy Sand, which is no harder than All Purpose, just sets faster. I've tried mesh with the hard, brown bag Dura Bond. I don't think it cracked. But that stuff is hard as rock. Pretty hard to beat the bazooka day in and day out. Fast, efficient, tested time and again. I am just slow to change something that works so well.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Tim0282 said:


> Good one, Capt. I've tried mesh with Easy Sand, which is no harder than All Purpose, just sets faster. I've tried mesh with the hard, brown bag Dura Bond. I don't think it cracked. But that stuff is hard as rock. Pretty hard to beat the bazooka day in and day out. Fast, efficient, tested time and again. I am just slow to change something that works so well.


 Thats kinda the thrust of this thead Tim,,,, the mesh guys are using Easy-sand,,, but when ya break it down,, they are only really talking about "seconds" that they saved. For insatnce my OP,,, I only have one flat, less than 8',,, since I have to bed it with easy-sand,,, what am I saveing if I use mess tape,,,,, how long would it take you to "tape" that flat with paper BEFORE you bed it with easy-sand,,,,,,,,, seconds,,,, am I right????


I could be wrong,,, but I'm not !!!!:thumbup:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Yea, you could be wrong__________________________ but cha aint!!!


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

When we start a house we mix ten or twelve buckets first thing. Enough to do the whole house. We don't stop every twenty minutes to wash the bucket and mix another bucket. I have never felt the speed thing with mesh. Now I will say the meshers get a tape and fill coat the first day on the flats. Not sure how they do angles. Not many mesh their angles, I don't think. Some do, I'm sure. We, fortunately have enough houses going all of the time that I need the time to tape, leave to go to another house and go back to fill the first one. Kinda do the spike and jump thing, you know. Spike this house and jump to the next and spike that one and jump back.... That is not in the Zig Zigler course on how to win friends and influence people.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

*no lie*

Taped house out in subdivision [weeks ago] taper next door started same day. when he left that evening [nosy] walked over. 
He taped all seams ,and butts with a/p/paper tape,, and blocked in all seams ,and butts same day,,a/p no hot mud atol. they taped angles next day, but I get that..Today started a home in same division those guys are still there.
there not painting ,,I know that .. Fast is not always fast.


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

So true, Moore!


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## boco (Oct 29, 2010)

I like mesh and durabond. Being doing it for about a year now. No problems and flatter seams. Still use papertape and Ap [proform black] for flats and butts. Do all my first coat of metal bead with ez 90. Been turning over 11000 sq ft homes every 6 days. Then we prime and touch up minor scratches. 6 down 11 to go. Mesh is good for the wallet


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

boco said:


> I like mesh and durabond. Being doing it for about a year now. No problems and flatter seams. Still use papertape and Ap [proform black] for flats and butts. Do all my first coat of metal bead with ez 90. Been turning over 11000 sq ft homes every 6 days. Then we prime and touch up minor scratches. 6 down 11 to go. Mesh is good for the wallet


:sweatdrop::sweatdrop:so far so good. IT takes about a year.


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Why would a joint be flatter using mesh as opposed to paper?


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## boco (Oct 29, 2010)

less shrinkage


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## chris (Apr 13, 2011)

boco said:


> I like mesh and durabond. Being doing it for about a year now. No problems and flatter seams.[ Still use papertape and Ap [proform black] for flats and butts.] where do u use mesh at:blink:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Good point Chris! I missed that statement. :blink:


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

mesh is thinner than paper.,, but when using hot mud the mesh will swell.
so will with paper tape.


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## chris (Apr 13, 2011)

moore said:


> mesh is thinner than paper.,, but when using hot mud the mesh will swell.
> so will with paper tape.


really???:blink: what brand papertape you use?


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

I have never noticed paper tape swelling. Or how could fiberglass tape swell?


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## boco (Oct 29, 2010)

I just mesh all seams. if theres a gap i just do same as you would paper to set it. same with butts. i did have some dry time issues with angles a couple weeks back. but other then that taping has been a joy. So freaking nice not haing to worry about delayedshrinkage and trying to recoat damp mud. Honestly since i made the switch to mesh and incorparated corner roller and flusher with a set of nailspotters its been the cleanist work i have ever done. Very very little sanding. Touch ups very minor. Mostly due to crew going out to trailer for lunch. Also if your a taper and you dont have any clean buckets what the hell do you do with them? i hope you dont throw them in dumpster. i clean every bucket i use. just a good habit


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## boco (Oct 29, 2010)

fiber fuse ultra-thin.


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## boco (Oct 29, 2010)

mesh doesnt swell like paper. No delayed shrinkage with ez 90


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

There is a difference between Fibafuse and mesh tape.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

The hot mud itself swells.


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## boco (Oct 29, 2010)

Tim0282 said:


> There is a difference between Fibafuse and mesh tape.


 My mistake Fibatape is what i use. Same company as fiba fuse. I think.


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## chris (Apr 13, 2011)

its the mud that swells (hotmud) does anyone use hotmud other than usg? We havnt used usg hotmud for years . I prefer smooth set lite:yes::yes: cool like whoop cream,fluffy good stuff plus it dont smell like catpiss and meth


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## boco (Oct 29, 2010)

moore said:


> The hot mud itself swells.


 That is true. The mesh doesnt. great for standups and high lighting areas.


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## boco (Oct 29, 2010)

chris said:


> its the mud that swells (hotmud) does anyone use hotmud other than usg? We havnt used usg hotmud for years . I prefer smooth set lite:yes::yes: cool like whoop cream,fluffy good stuff plus it dont smell like catpiss and meth


 i was using quick set lite. Mostly for modulars, but now use usg. Had some problems with bead and butts cracking. After a call to the rep. he basically suggested using ap to set tape. just dont have time for that. I like quick set but when conditions arent perfect you may have problems.


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## Mudstar (Feb 15, 2008)

Final touch drywall said:


> still waiting>>>>:whistling2::whistling2:
> 
> 
> still waiting>>>>:whistling2::whistling2:
> ...



all mesh jobs crack sometime period......................


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Mudstar said:


> all mesh jobs crack sometime period......................


Mudstar !!!!!!! you put up your first helpful post :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


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## Mudstar (Feb 15, 2008)

2buckcanuck said:


> Mudstar !!!!!!! you put up your first helpful post :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


2431 posts in one year , your have to be the post whore :thumbsup:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Mudstar said:


> 2431 posts in one year , your have to be the post whore :thumbsup:


Came across some of your work the other day Mudstar


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## smisner50s (Jan 6, 2011)

2buckcanuck said:


> Came across some of your work the other day Mudstar


That's a tight coat


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> Came across some of your work the other day Mudstar


When will those hand finishers ever learn??


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

At least it ain't cracked yet,,,,, but then again, he ain't skimmed it 3 times yet either. 

Oh heck NO,,, is that paper at the edge of the door???????????

He's a NON-BELIEVER,,,,,,, how could he possibly use paper on a mesh job????


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

Talk about butt ugly, that picture sucked, BTW, can't believe I read all of this thread so far. Here is my take, I use mesh on certain repair jobs, small patches plugs, But Never for a New home or remodel job of any size to it. I don't care how long you have been finishing, The best job will be paper tape applied with a BANJO! sure a auto taper is fine as well, but you don't have the freedom of setting your mud flow the way you want. I can open it up for butts and angles, choke it down for flats, less time spent on wiping the tape on the flats,and they turn out perfect,You can say what you want about using Hot mud , all I can say it is slow and a pain in the azz to cleanup. . and it is not superior to paper at all. 1 hour or less I can have 10,000 sq ft of board coated out with my box by myself, You can't tell me a hand finisher can do that, and still make it as nice as my box work.


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

:yawn::sleeping::clap:Banjo taper is better than a bazooka? Oh my........ Yer in for a ride!


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

Tim0282 said:


> :yawn::sleeping::clap:Banjo taper is better than a bazooka? Oh my........ Yer in for a ride!


Really? tell me all about it ! Enlighten me if you will. Give me your great wisdom and vast knowledge , instead of stupid smilies out the azz OK?


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Tim0282 said:


> :yawn::sleeping::clap:Banjo taper is better than a bazooka? Oh my........ Yer in for a ride!


Hhhhhmmmmmm

He didn't really say it was better so, he said it was fine..... I remember the captain saying that could be one thing changed on the bazooka, making the flow on it adjustable. But the point of betterdrywalls post is paper tape is better.....ill sit on the fence for this one:whistling2:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

I didn't say I had any wisdom or vast knowledge. Wouldn't say the banjo is better than a bazooka, though. Sure would say the bazooka is faster if for no other reason than it holds more mud. And I don't think the emoticons are stupid. Furthermore I wasn't disagreeing with you fully. But your attitude speaks volumes. A little touchy aren't you?


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Tim0282 said:


> I didn't say I had any wisdom or vast knowledge. Wouldn't say the banjo is better than a bazooka, though. Sure would say the bazooka is faster if for no other reason than it holds more mud. And I don't think the emoticons are stupid. Furthermore I wasn't disagreeing with you fully. But your attitude speaks volumes. A little touchy aren't you?


Dear god, thank god there are emotion cons, I would be lost if guys didn't use them, sometimes you don't know if a guy is joking or being serious. Plus some of them make you laugh.









I have never seen no one use a banjo where I live, But I think it goes without saying, the Bazooka is the champ, it better be for the money you pay for one:blink:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Well if the 80 dollar toy was better than the 1200 dollar toy..... they would switch places, don't ya think? Then the banjo would cost 1200 and the bazooka would cost 80 bucks. That's the way society works, I think. The banjo definitely has a place, but to say it does a better job, well.... I can't agree. With all due respect. On that note, I was just reading a post about a guy that just bought a Columbia taper. Said "we" put on 38 rolls of tape today! Now that's a lot of tape. Asked him how many "we's" there were with him. That is 19,000 feet of tape if using 500' rolls. I don't even need wisdom or much knowledge to know that's a lot of tape. We have never strung 38 rolls in one day. With a banjo or a bazooka!


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

sdrdrywall 
Member

Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: northern nj
Posts: 91 
Thanks: 16
Thanked 23 Times in 20 Posts 










Okay so 2 days with the new taper runs great looks great . It's head and shoulders above my tape tech . First day with it we busted ass and put up 38 rolls of tape can't say enough good things about wall tools great service from good people .


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

Timmy, I am not talking about any speed races, and a bazooka is a great tool, But it does not have any forgiveness,like the banjo. Every hand finisher needs to run a banjo for quality. stringing mesh and coating it out with hottmud by hand does not make a person a real Hand finisher.And a good hand finisher knows that being able to apply the Correct amount of mud behind the tape before it is wiped down ,only helps to make for cleaner stronger joints with less work involved in the process. Most guys never try to adjust a banjo ,or to take the amount of time necessary to actually learn how to run one properly. A banjo maybe abit messy for you hands and cloths at time, but it lays on some clean tape. and that is what is important. P.S. have a Smiley day Timmy, don't get so emotional next time! Ha!


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> Dear god, thank god there are emotion cons, I would be lost if guys didn't use them, sometimes you don't know if a guy is joking or being serious. Plus some of them make you laugh.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Yeah a bazooka is a great tool. But I feel it is one tool that needs to be completely boycotted and done away with, too many guys running and gunnin with a bazooka in there hand ,and working for dirt cheap because they don't care about quality, just speed ,and a fast paycheck. If we finisher would only learn to slow down, and at the same time get more support from the supply side , maybe we could actually get better quality paying Builders and GC's. :wallbash:


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## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> I have never seen no one use a banjo where I live, But I think it goes without saying, the Bazooka is the champ


There's times when I find a banjo to be a better solution. At least for me.


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## chris (Apr 13, 2011)

putting tape on wall is faster with bazooka , wiping is not. Banjo a tad bit slower putting tape on but much quicker wiping down,not to mention cleaner blister free:yes: Im a banjo guy ,usually wipe, never do I have to touch tape . clean hands =happy hands=clean cell phone=clean clothes=clean vehicle. I really hate mud oon my hands


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## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

chris said:


> Banjo a tad bit slower putting tape on but much quicker wiping down


And as I've said before:

- quicker setup, takedown and cleanup - I rarely clean it, just plastic bag it.
- can also get more mud out of it if I want - eg. some bevelled corners and places where flat taping gaps
- can also better keep tape lengths such that they don't overlap, and I'm not having to coat 2 tape widths in spots - which can equal less coating time, less drying time, less sanding, fewer deficiencies, nicer finish.


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## sdrdrywall (Sep 4, 2010)

I don't know what you guys are talking. About I would never use a banjo again bazooka hands down faster cleaner ....


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

betterdrywall said:


> Timmy, I am not talking about any speed races, and a bazooka is a great tool, But it does not have any forgiveness,like the banjo. Every hand finisher needs to run a banjo for quality. stringing mesh and coating it out with hottmud by hand does not make a person a real Hand finisher.And a good hand finisher knows that being able to apply the Correct amount of mud behind the tape before it is wiped down ,only helps to make for cleaner stronger joints with less work involved in the process. Most guys never try to adjust a banjo ,or to take the amount of time necessary to actually learn how to run one properly. A banjo maybe abit messy for you hands and cloths at time, but it lays on some clean tape. and that is what is important. P.S. have a Smiley day Timmy, don't get so emotional next time! Ha!


:boxing: I don't appreciate sarcasm. I respect your opinion. It stops there. :bangin:


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

LMAO, I wasn't being sarcastic or touchy in any of my post, I am happy to see your able to make good use of those smilies!


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

They are called emoticons....

An emoticon (English pronunciation: /ɪˈmoʊtɪkɒn/) is a facial expression pictorially represented by punctuation and letters, usually to express a writer’s mood. Emoticons are often used to alert a responder to the tenor or temper of a statement, and can change and improve interpretation of plain text.:cowboy: Threw that one in since your are from Oklahoma. (he's a cowboy)


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> .
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am finishing a duplex, 87 sheets per side. Doing it by myself since we elected Barak (he took the bussiness away), anyhoo, I taped it with a banjo, cause a bazooka is primarily a two man tool(can't afford a swamper anymore, had to drop $2.00/brd, see above mention of Barak) 

Anyway, today I went to start the corners and angles(I always let the flats and butts dry before using an anglehead), they kinda mess up wet tape. I took the zooka, cause I got two of em and I wanted to use them again before I die(see previous mention of Barak)

After a cpl hours, I stuck it in a buck of water, put my stilts on, and used the banjo to do it,,, way faster, cleaner, and more precise.

And yes,,, the banjo I used was $100 12 years ago and the TWO zooka's I had in the truck were $1200 apieace, not to mention the pump.

I said all that to say this,,, If your a one man operation,,,, a banjo will SMOKE a zooka's arse.


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Are you wiping your angles down with tools? (when you banjo)


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Tim0282 said:


> Are you wiping your angles down with tools? (when you banjo)


 Yep, I string it with tha banjo, roll it, then pull the mudrunner over it with a 31/2, same as the zooka.


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Nice! So in running the Mudrunner, you add a little mud to the angle. Do you have to run them again when they are dry? Or are they smooth enough because you did the Mudrunner?


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> I am finishing a duplex, 87 sheets per side. Doing it by myself since we elected Barak (he took the bussiness away), anyhoo, I taped it with a banjo, cause a bazooka is primarily a two man tool(can't afford a swamper anymore, had to drop $2.00/brd, see above mention of Barak)
> 
> Anyway, today I went to start the corners and angles(I always let the flats and butts dry before using an anglehead), they kinda mess up wet tape. I took the zooka, cause I got two of em and I wanted to use them again before I die(see previous mention of Barak)
> 
> ...


Interesting to read that Capt, I have put the zooka down and go the banjo for flats now as i want to use hotmud for the tapecoat, Its giving me way less shrinkage issues over the taping mud through the zooka and it really does not seem much slower, still bowl over a heap of flats in a day and its set good to go 2nd coat the next or even the same day, I still like the zooka for corners though, roll then mudrun. All purpose taping mud mix, The corners are not as thick as the flats and harder to see so shrinkage is less of an issue.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> I am finishing a duplex, 87 sheets per side. Doing it by myself since we elected Barak (he took the bussiness away), anyhoo, I taped it with a banjo, cause a bazooka is primarily a two man tool(can't afford a swamper anymore, had to drop $2.00/brd, see above mention of Barak)
> 
> Anyway, today I went to start the corners and angles(I always let the flats and butts dry before using an anglehead), they kinda mess up wet tape. I took the zooka, cause I got two of em and I wanted to use them again before I die(see previous mention of Barak)
> 
> ...


WHAT:blink:?? You didn't vote for change? everyone else did .
[[email protected]] We got what he promised .


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

I didn't realize you guys were running the MudRunner on the first coat. Good idea!


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

betterdrywall said:


> Yeah a bazooka is a great tool. But I feel it is one tool that needs to be completely boycotted and done away with, too many guys running and gunnin with a bazooka in there hand ,and working for dirt cheap because they don't care about quality, just speed ,and a fast paycheck. If we finisher would only learn to slow down, and at the same time get more support from the supply side , maybe we could actually get better quality paying Builders and GC's. :wallbash:


Yeah, ok ,The classic blame the machine, and not the guy behind the machine.

Laying the tape is maybe 1/5 of the job, What about all the coating ,screws, beads, sanding and checking that come with the rest of the job.

Yes I have seen guys cut loose with a bazooka on large jobs (me being one of them) But thats more of the management allowing it to happen. I have also seen guys hang themselves buy taking to much on. It all works out in the wash.

If you want things to change economically, it's not done with the machines you buy, it's done politically ,it's who you vote for

Sounds like your the type of guy who's looking for" Change"


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Tim0282 said:


> I didn't realize you guys were running the MudRunner on the first coat. Good idea!


Yeah man, Its great, I run the 3.5 on it behind the corner roller, Fills and evens it fantastic, Even if it only a very small amount of mud added is makes a huge difference, Im odd as i run the tapeworm 4 to finish which is a little slow, the capt runs a 2.5 to finsih which is hell fast.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Tim0282 said:


> Nice! So in running the Mudrunner, you add a little mud to the angle. Do you have to run them again when they are dry? Or are they smooth enough because you did the Mudrunner?


 Here's the long and the short of it,,, You can get by with one coat like that IF the hangers didn't BEAT holes in the rock when they hung it. Your tape will still photograph(that means, look at a photograph of the mountains, then close your eyes and try to FELL the mountains on the photograph,, you can't). If you have a GC or a boss that don't WANT to SEE the tape, you can't get by with it. However, it will paint out just as good as coating it again. In my neck of the woods, they want two coats, wheater it needs it or not!!!! Heck they want us to 2 coat the top angle even if they are gonna hang crown mold (they say, I'm paying ya to do it, so i want it)


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

I run the 3" easy roll on the first coat and a 3 and a half on the second coat.


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

I like doing a second coat. Just to go over it twice.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> Yeah, ok ,The classic blame the machine, and not the guy behind the machine.
> 
> Laying the tape is maybe 1/5 of the job, What about all the coating ,screws, beads, sanding and checking that come with the rest of the job.
> 
> ...


I'm looking for change sho nuff, he gets re-elected, I'm quitting and going to selling dope,,, 

Socialism is great till ya run out of OTHER peoples money


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Tim0282 said:


> I run the 3" easy roll on the first coat and a 3 and a half on the second coat.


 2buck does that too, but he's from BC and posts alot of pics about sheep!!!!!!!


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

That is scary, isn't it?!?


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

I like to run bigger than smaller for a varity of reasons.
1) you don't have worry about picking up trash from the first coat
2)you don't have to sand between coats, less your bored and need somthing to do
3)you don't have to worry about the "water-line", sander will get it
4) its alot less strain (smaller head)
5) you don't have to worry about covering a defect in the rock that you will have to come back and fix later, that you would have already found from the first coat.
6) (my favorite) the second coat that way is super fast and takes no real concentration,,,,,leaving more time to drink beer!!!!!!!!!


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> I'm looking for change sho nuff, he gets re-elected, I'm quitting and going to selling dope,,,
> 
> Socialism is great till ya run out of OTHER peoples money


I don't do drugs [anymore] ,,but maybe a change would do me good.
What cha got?


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> I am finishing a duplex, 87 sheets per side. Doing it by myself since we elected Barak (he took the bussiness away), anyhoo, I taped it with a banjo, cause a bazooka is primarily a two man tool(can't afford a swamper anymore, had to drop $2.00/brd, see above mention of Barak)
> 
> Anyway, today I went to start the corners and angles(I always let the flats and butts dry before using an anglehead), they kinda mess up wet tape. I took the zooka, cause I got two of em and I wanted to use them again before I die(see previous mention of Barak)
> 
> ...


Well here we go !!!!!!! 

Bazooka is a labour replacing machine period, it allows me to increase production, another words,fire someones arse and not have it affect my income. If I choose to employ another worker, it makes it that much more faster. To me, laying tape, corner flushing and sanding make a huge difference with 2 guys, other than that the labour can sit at home.

Does the bazooka require a pump. yes it does, but it will also service my other machines, so it's not conclusive to just the bazooka.

Your also stating your using the stilts in conjunction with the banjo, take away the stilts and how fast is the banjo against the bazooka now. I'm almost 50, The less I'm on the stilts the better IMO at my age.

And why not do the angles 1st instead of your flats. All the tapes on in one day is all the tapes on, don't matter which order their done in. They will be dry the next day.

I get it that a lot of guys use the banjo south of the boarder, Seems more guys in Canada use the slop bucket if they don't have the bazooka (some the cp tube) It's to each his own. does it really matter if a guy gets his tape on one hour more faster than the next guy in a house.

But if someone said, here's 50,000 sq ft, go nuts, nothing is going to beat the bazooka,,,,period (well a cfs bazooka, but.....)


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

moore said:


> I don't do drugs [anymore] ,,but maybe a change would do me good.
> What cha got?


 Well, I'm trying to ease into it, right now I got 10 gals of plum wine 7%, 5 gal of plum wine 15%, and 5 gals of hard lemonade at 9%.

Thinking about making some scarey cherry lemonade.

However ifin he gets re-lected,,, I got other connections,,, what the hay,,, at the worst I can get free rent, dental, medical,clothes,food, and all the sleep I want,,,,,,,,, dam, sounding better than drywall all the time


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> Well here we go !!!!!!!
> 
> Bazooka is a labour replacing machine period, it allows me to increase production, another words,fire someones arse and not have it affect my income. If I choose to employ another worker, it makes it that much more faster. To me, laying tape, corner flushing and sanding make a huge difference with 2 guys, other than that the labour can sit at home.
> 
> ...


I understand your arguments 2buck,,,,,,
1) Stilts are easier on your body than walking on a concrete slab
2) A banjo on the top angles are faster than a bazooka(not counting the mud capacity, so thats debateable),wanna race???
3) a banjo is dead on precise, placeing tape in the corners,,, can YOU place tape perfectly in EVERY corner with a zooka????? BAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH,,, I can't
4) never, ever,at any time, for any reason,,, confuse a banjo with a slop-box


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## cdwoodcox (Jan 3, 2011)

banjo definitely has a quicker learning curve than bazooka. but once you get used to bazooka taping will become much more efficient and physically easier. 
As far as guys running and gunning with no regard to quality those guys will do that with any tool in their hand.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

:lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

moore said:


> :lol::lol::lol::lol:


 Ya think this is funny don't ya,,,,,,,,

Your right!!!!!!!!:thumbup: it is


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Do you categorize a banjo finisher a hand finisher?


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> I understand your arguments 2buck,,,,,,
> 1) Stilts are easier on your body than walking on a concrete slab
> 2) A banjo on the top angles are faster than a bazooka(not counting the mud capacity, so thats debateable),wanna race???
> 3) a banjo is dead on precise, placeing tape in the corners,,, can YOU place tape perfectly in EVERY corner with a zooka????? BAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH,,, I can't
> 4) never, ever,at any time, for any reason,,, confuse a banjo with a slop-box


actually, if there was one thing I was to brag about myself, and I don't mean to be arrogant, but I am very accurate with the bazookie, other tapers have complimented me on it. I do sacrifice some speed though. On the other hand (cd stating in his post) with 2Bjr, it's all about the speed to him, and we get in major fights over it. I'm always arguing, whats the point in you racing, if I just got to fix everything.

All the machines are nice to have, but we should not half to race at break neck speeds. We should have a international tape by hand week, it would remind the DWC's and GC what a difference the machines make.

And Moore can be all excited then


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Tim0282 said:


> Do you categorize a banjo finisher a hand finisher?


 Interesting question,,,,, I would,,, when I use a banjo and then do the rest with hand tools, I consider it a "hand finsh". I guess its all in the definition tho.


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

So who makes the best banjo?


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> Ya think this is funny don't ya,,,,,,,,
> 
> Your right!!!!!!!!:thumbup: it is


Hey ,,If you guys were to hand finish like REAL drywall men,,,
there wouldn't be any spats on who's using the right machine.:thumbsup:

hawk,,5,,6,,8,,10,,12,,sandpaper. check
just joking ,,,cant touch the machines.:no:


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

moore said:


> Hey ,,If you guys were to hand finish like REAL drywall men,,,
> there wouldn't be any spats on who's using the right machine.:thumbsup:
> 
> hawk,,5,,6,,8,,10,,12,,sandpaper. check.


 LOL,,, been there, done that, bought the tools!!!!:thumbup:


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> actually, if there was one thing I was to brag about myself, and I don't mean to be arrogant, but I am very accurate with the bazookie, other tapers have complimented me on it. I do sacrifice some speed though. On the other hand (cd stating in his post) with 2Bjr, it's all about the speed to him, and we get in major fights over it. I'm always arguing, whats the point in you racing, if I just got to fix everything.
> 
> All the machines are nice to have, but we should not half to race at break neck speeds. We should have a international tape by hand week, it would remind the DWC's and GC what a difference the machines make.
> 
> And Moore can be all excited then


I would be [ what was that] did you see that?
where did it go?:blink:check please.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> actually, if there was one thing I was to brag about myself, and I don't mean to be arrogant, but I am very accurate with the bazookie, other tapers have complimented me on it. I do sacrifice some speed though. On the other hand (cd stating in his post) with 2Bjr, it's all about the speed to him, and we get in major fights over it. I'm always arguing, whats the point in you racing, if I just got to fix everything.
> 
> All the machines are nice to have, but we should not half to race at break neck speeds. We should have a international tape by hand week, it would remind the DWC's and GC what a difference the machines make.
> 
> And Moore can be all excited then


 I ran a banjo for near twenty years before I got a zooka, so its an easy strecth that I'm pretty adept at it. However, I have seen guys that have been running zookas all their life that cannot run top angles and lay EVERY SINGLE tape perfectly in each corner. Never seen one,,, but then again, I ain't seen it done in Canada,, LOL. Don't miss understand me on this, I have seen a BUNCH of guys that can lay it in there better than I can. However, I was trying to say that if ONE man is running the job by himself, a banjo is faster on top angles than a zooka.


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Tim0282 said:


> Do you categorize a banjo finisher a hand finisher?


Banjo is a machine, but I think the 2 major machines would be the boxes and angle tools, b/c of the finish they do. Plus you can see the difference between a hand finish as opposed to machine finish with those applications.

After that, does a power sanded make you a machine taper??????? does a nail spotter.......

If I had to give up all the toys and keep one, it would be the angle tools I keep. We tend to forget how import angles done by machine save us time etc..... question is, what angle tools do you keep:blink:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

You get on your stilts to run the bazooka in the angles. Do you run the roller and MudRunner from your stilts?


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

It's ALL done by hand.
Each tool needs an experienced hand behind it.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Tim0282 said:


> You get on your stilts to run the bazooka in the angles. Do you run the roller and MudRunner from your stilts?


 Yep, I have one of them blue scaffolds from Blowes,,, I put a bucket of banjo mud on it, a bucket of mudrunner mud on it(with pump in it), a bucket of water with my roller and a pole with a 2" head on it for short corners(close doors). I run the tape(2 or 3 jo's) then wash my hands(got a towel there too) then roll the corners, then run em with the mudrunner, then pick em. I don't get down off the stilts till all the top angles are run and the corners are run down to just below the flats.


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> I ran a banjo for near twenty years before I got a zooka, so its an easy strecth that I'm pretty adept at it. However, I have seen guys that have been running zookas all their life that cannot run top angles and lay EVERY SINGLE tape perfectly in each corner. Never seen one,,, but then again, I ain't seen it done in Canada,, LOL. Don't miss understand me on this, I have seen a BUNCH of guys that can lay it in there better than I can. However, I was trying to say that if ONE man is running the job by himself, a banjo is faster on top angles than a zooka.


Looks like I'm going to half to steal my daughters camera again:whistling2:

I don't like appearing on camera though, (too good looking:jester guess I'm going to half to tell 2bjr (akk dumb arse) to slow down a bit and run off some perfect tapes.

It's all bazooka here where we are, There's around 25 permanent tapers in the DWC I work for, their all bazooka boys. There's one that runs the slop bucket, and he's a ex bazooka guy, I just don't think his wife will let him buy a new one ( sorry if your reading this Terry):whistling2:

Oh, and I live in Ontario, that province you visited once, saying I'm from Bc is like telling a New yorker their from San Fransisco ..... yikes


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Sounds like a good system. I bought one of those scaffolds. Can't think of the name right off. It is, or was red. It's white of course now. Man, that thing will kill ya! You try to scoot it one way while on it and it'll go the other. Either rolls really fast or when the wheels are full of mud it won't roll at all. But they are a handy one to have around.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> Looks like I'm going to half to steal my daughters camera again:whistling2:
> 
> I don't like appearing on camera though, (too good looking:jester guess I'm going to half to tell 2bjr (akk dumb arse) to slow down a bit and run off some perfect tapes.
> 
> ...


 Sorry bout the BC thing,,,, my bad !!!!


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

moore said:


> It's ALL done by hand.
> Each tool needs an experienced hand behind it.


DWT party at moores house, since he likes do everything buy hand, he can hand us all our beers


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

Tim0282 said:


> Sounds like a good system. I bought one of those scaffolds. Can't think of the name right off. It is, or was red. It's white of course now. Man, that thing will kill ya! You try to scoot it one way while on it and it'll go the other. Either rolls really fast or when the wheels are full of mud it won't roll at all. But they are a handy one to have around.


 Yeah, but they are great for loading your mud up on and scooting it around the house,,,,,, when ya get old enough that ya don't want to keep walking all over the place to re-load, just grab a post and drag it to the next room with ya


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

No doubt!:thumbsup:


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> DWT party at moores house, since he likes do everything buy hand, he can hand us all our beers


You'd just sit there and look at it, waiting for someone to hand you a tool to open it with!!!!!!!:thumbsup:


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> Looks like I'm going to half to steal my daughters camera again:whistling2:
> 
> I don't like appearing on camera though, (too good looking:jester guess I'm going to half to tell 2bjr (akk dumb arse) to slow down a bit and run off some perfect tapes.
> 
> ...


I got own camera today. no more borrowing the kids camera. 
:thumbup:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Tim0282 said:


> Sounds like a good system. I bought one of those scaffolds. Can't think of the name right off. It is, or was red. It's white of course now. Man, that thing will kill ya! You try to scoot it one way while on it and it'll go the other. Either rolls really fast or when the wheels are full of mud it won't roll at all. But they are a handy one to have around.


The wheels on those red ones are too good:blink:, their like being on a skate board. If it ever breaks down or someone steals it:furious: Get those yellow ones, you got to give them that little body push/dance to get them moving. I tend to use them more well 2bjr uses the stilts, He bought those sky walkers since he broke mine, they hurt me when I walk on his so..... :blink:


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> You'd just sit there and look at it, waiting for someone to hand you a tool to open it with!!!!!!!:thumbsup:


I have never laughed till it hurt in years!!


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

2buckcanuck said:


> DWT party at moores house, since he likes do everything buy hand, he can hand us all our beers


The coolers full . ,,,and there's more from where that came from.
ALL brothers are welcome.. :notworthy:


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

2buck, when I have to compete with guys running around on the cheap buying supplies from My supplier without being register with the state or have their own workers comp insurance and still doing ton's of work for Cheap something has to be done, they fly in a house with there bazooka apply one coat of mud over the joints none on angles turn around and texture, see it happen all the time. and no I aint no socialist at all.


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## Jason (Feb 27, 2011)

Tim0282 said:


> So who makes the best banjo?


Homax


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

betterdrywall said:


> 2buck, when I have to compete with guys running around on the cheap buying supplies from My supplier without being register with the state or have their own workers comp insurance and still doing ton's of work for Cheap something has to be done, they fly in a house with there bazooka apply one coat of mud over the joints none on angles turn around and texture, see it happen all the time. and no I aint no socialist at all.


I know what your saying betterdrywall, I just can't see blaming it all on machines, and I don't want to stir up a hornets nest. You know I always fire up silly little post and pics of things, I seen a opportunity to fire up a Obama joke, I'm sure the texture gut will like it. All I can say is where I work their extremely fussy about quality and everyone is a machine taper. (except on those big union government jobs).

Just come to Canada if you like quality :thumbsup: Just keep ta hell away from Quebec


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

2buckcanuck said:


> I know what your saying betterdrywall, I just can't see blaming it all on machines, and I don't want to stir up a hornets nest. You know I always fire up silly little post and pics of things, I seen a opportunity to fire up a Obama joke, I'm sure the texture gut will like it. All I can say is where I work their extremely fussy about quality and everyone is a machine taper. (except on those big union government jobs).
> 
> Just come to Canada if you like quality :thumbsup: Just keep ta hell away from Quebec


 I went to Quebec one time,,, and it was closed:yes:


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

well 2buck your right it is not too fair to point the finger at the tool. I just see builders taking advantage of all they can get , higher ceilings cut up homes and so forth. to futher my point, machine tapers can only preform one task. where the hell is Quebec?


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

betterdrywall said:


> well 2buck your right it is not too fair to point the finger at the tool. I just see builders taking advantage of all they can get , higher ceilings cut up homes and so forth. to futher my point, machine tapers can only preform one task. where the hell is Quebec?


Dear god it is true, Americans learn their geography by invading countries

Quebec is that big land mass north of Maine and Vermont, their our french population that is our biggest welfare state province. They always threaten to separate and our federal government gives them tons of money and always kisses their arse so they won't leave. So if you guys want to invade and take them over, the rest of Canada will be very happy:thumbsup:

do you yanks like frenchmen:whistling2:


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## betterdrywall (May 4, 2010)

Well 2Buck I consider myself a Rebel, and the only Frenchmen I know about, lives in the deep south of Florida, they like messin with the alligators!


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