# First spray knockdown



## getplastered

I've been very clear that I am not an experience spray texture guy...I have rolled, mopped and knocked down a few times with success, but my gc wants me to match a knockdown done on his old house which was done with a hopper. 

So I bought a hopper....shot it in my garage and knocked it down...which was kinda cool. I guess I'm looking for some pointers before I go and fubar the ceilings in his new house!

Granted, he said start in the walk ins to get some practice! He knows this will be my first time...what a guy...

The bedrooms aren't bad...it's the living area...it's huge! How much do I spray before I start knocking down? What setting works best? Where in the room do I start? We will be 2 guys...oh and can I shoot from the floor on a 9 foot ceiling?

Any I put would be great!


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## thefinisher

getplastered said:


> I've been very clear that I am not an experience spray texture guy...I have rolled, mopped and knocked down a few times with success, but my gc wants me to match a knockdown done on his old house which was done with a hopper.
> 
> So I bought a hopper....shot it in my garage and knocked it down...which was kinda cool. I guess I'm looking for some pointers before I go and fubar the ceilings in his new house!
> 
> Granted, he said start in the walk ins to get some practice! He knows this will be my first time...what a guy...
> 
> The bedrooms aren't bad...it's the living area...it's huge! How much do I spray before I start knocking down? What setting works best? Where in the room do I start? We will be 2 guys...oh and can I shoot from the floor on a 9 foot ceiling?
> 
> Any I put would be great!


The setting depends on the size you are trying to duplicate. Timing is the biggest thing. The size or thickness of the knockdown has much to do with how long you let it sit on the wall/ceiling before you wipe it down. Wipe it down too fast and the texture will be much flatter and not have as much depth to it. If you wait too long it will end up looking like awful orange peel. Just do some test areas and see how long it takes until it knocks down to the right texture for you :thumbsup:. Also you should be able to spray 9' ceilings without any problem.


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## chris

Try to get a flexy plastic KD knife. Like plexyglass:yes:


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## PrecisionTaping

No worries bro.
Knockdown's are easy stuff.
My hopper's been stuck on the 2nd biggest setting for ever.
The little screw just kind'a rusted in place, so my knockdown's are always on that setting. lol.
I always spray my ceilings in layers. I know some guys just fill it all in thick as they go. I don't do that. I do one light pass over the whole ceiling. Just cover the whole are. So for my first pass, i'll do like a quick left to right and cover everything. After that, for my second pass I change directions and will spray front to back sort of thing. My second pass is the one I spray a little slower because I fill in a little more, get that nice uniform spray.
If it's a big ceiling I do the same process but after the whole ceilings done I just run back to wherever I started and give a really fast and light spray just to make sure it's not drying up on me.
Then I tear down all my poly, scrape the sides of the wall, fill my staple holes, and in between doing all of that, I will check a little corner every now and then to make sure it's not setting up too quick.
Just check where you first started. Use a small knife like a 6" at first just to see if it's setup enough.

I actually use a 6" to wipe my entire ceiling.
I know allot of guys will laugh at that, but all the contractors in town like my knockdown's the best compared to other company's. They don't know what I do differently. haha. I just use a 6" knife. I find you have more control. I see allot of guys use the wider knockdown knives and they get crappy results because it flattens out too much at a time. If they happen to go across a butt joint, thy flatten out too much of it and you can tell there's a noticeable hump. Seen it a hundred times.
Laugh all you want. I like my 6" knife for knocking down.
Ceilings look perfect every time.


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## chris

PrecisionTaping said:


> No worries bro.
> Knockdown's are easy stuff.
> My hopper's been stuck on the 2nd biggest setting for ever.
> The little screw just kind'a rusted in place, so my knockdown's are always on that setting. lol.
> I always spray my ceilings in layers. I know some guys just fill it all in thick as they go. I don't do that. I do one light pass over the whole ceiling. Just cover the whole are. So for my first pass, i'll do like a quick left to right and cover everything. After that, for my second pass I change directions and will spray front to back sort of thing. My second pass is the one I spray a little slower because I fill in a little more, get that nice uniform spray.
> If it's a big ceiling I do the same process but after the whole ceilings done I just run back to wherever I started and give a really fast and light spray just to make sure it's not drying up on me.
> Then I tear down all my poly, scrape the sides of the wall, fill my staple holes, and in between doing all of that, I will check a little corner every now and then to make sure it's not setting up too quick.
> Just check where you first started. Use a small knife like a 6" at first just to see if it's setup enough.
> 
> I actually use a 6" to wipe my entire ceiling.
> I know allot of guys will laugh at that, but all the contractors in town like my knockdown's the best compared to other company's. They don't know what I do differently. haha. I just use a 6" knife. I find you have more control. I see allot of guys use the wider knockdown knives and they get crappy results because it flattens out too much at a time. If they happen to go across a butt joint, thy flatten out too much of it and you can tell there's a noticeable hump. Seen it a hundred times.
> Laugh all you want. I like my 6" knife for knocking down.
> Ceilings look perfect every time.


 If your joints were flat you wouldnt get those humps:whistling2: Just kiddin ya. I KDd for years using the 18" Metal KD knife and when I tried the plastic flexy I was blown away:blink: Very forgiving


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## moore

This is gettin good...:shifty:


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## getplastered

chris said:


> Try to get a flexy plastic KD knife. Like plexyglass:yes:


I got one of those magic trowels...pretty slick....same idea I think...!


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## getplastered

Cool, cool....thanks for the input! I just feel that by the time I'm done spraying that bloody living area, my mud will have started setting up where I started...

If I understand, I should be able to do this alone? Spray, they go knockdown? I get that timing is important...I guess we spray first and see!

Mix mud to corner box consistency or zook consistency? 

Thanks guys!


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## getplastered

moore said:


> This is gettin good...:shifty:


Common Moore...spit it out!!:blink:


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## PrecisionTaping

chris said:


> If your joints were flat you wouldnt get those humps:whistling2: Just kiddin ya. I KDd for years using the 18" Metal KD knife and when I tried the plastic flexy I was blown away:blink: Very forgiving


I didn't say my joints! lol!
Other tapers I said.



moore said:


> This is gettin good...:shifty:


Moore! Don't encourage Chris! lol



getplastered said:


> Cool, cool....thanks for the input! I just feel that by the time I'm done spraying that bloody living area, my mud will have started setting up where I started...
> 
> If I understand, I should be able to do this alone? Spray, they go knockdown? I get that timing is important...I guess we spray first and see!
> 
> Mix mud to corner box consistency or zook consistency?
> 
> Thanks guys!


You should be able to do it alone. I usually do it with two guys, but all the other guy does is really prep the rooms with plastic and then when I'm out of mud in my hopper I turn my air at the gun off, and he'll come running over and I'll hold the hopper steady when he pours more mud in, then he'll go back and keep putting up plastic in the next room for me.
Then when I finish in the room I was in I go into the next one and then he comes back into the one I just finished, tears down all the plastic, removes the staples, cleans the edge. Usually I can spray 2 or 3 bedrooms before having to stop and knockdown the first one. At which point the other guy keeps spraying and then I just knockdown all the bedrooms and follow him.

I always say you can't mix the mud too thin when doing knockdown.
I mix mine really thin. You've got to be able to pour it out of the bucket easily.


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## chris

getplastered said:


> Cool, cool....thanks for the input! I just feel that by the time I'm done spraying that bloody living area, my mud will have started setting up where I started...
> 
> If I understand, I should be able to do this alone? Spray, they go knockdown? I get that timing is important...I guess we spray first and see!
> 
> Mix mud to corner box consistency or zook consistency?
> 
> Thanks guys!


 I wouldnt do a big lid by myself but Im sure some guys can. The rooms up to say 20' 20 ' I would do but if its any bigger I would want help. Do as much prep as you can before you start spraying, you dont want to have to stop to do ANYTHING other than spray JMO. Maybe get dialed in on the rooms and small areas and get some help for the big lid once youve got a lil experience, that way you can tell them whats up. One of my first big comm. job 20 years ago I was handed a KD knife and told start here and do this:blink:,, in other words no sweat


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## charlesdumar

Do not knockdown with a 6 inch knife get a Knockdown Blade from All wall and do it like a pro.


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## moore

charlesdumar said:


> do not knockdown with a 6 inch knife get a knoTHAT'S ckdown blade from all wall and do it like a pro.


 maybe you should open up to a new way. 

never hurts!


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## PrecisionTaping

charlesdumar said:


> Do not knockdown with a 6 inch knife get a Knockdown Blade from All wall and do it like a pro.


Why don't you show me what pro's knockdown should look like? :whistling2:


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## DLSdrywall

charlesdumar said:


> Do not knockdown with a 6 inch knife get a Knockdown Blade from All wall and do it like a pro.


So are you saying my piece of cardboard on my flusher pole is not professional...but what if my knockdown looks better, would you buy knockdown cardboard from all wall for 60 bucks:whistling2:


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## charlesdumar

Ok I will post some knockdown videos. Just trying to set the guy up for success. If you brought a six inch knife to knockdown the ceilings of the house we sprayed yesterday you would still be there knocking down. That chit doesn't fly in these parts.


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## moore

charlesdumar said:


> Ok I will post some knockdown videos. Just trying to set the guy up for success. If you brought a six inch knife to knockdown the ceilings of the house we sprayed yesterday you would still be there knocking down. That chit doesn't fly in these parts.


 yes!! a knock down vid! thank you!


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## PrecisionTaping

DLSdrywall said:


> So are you saying my piece of cardboard on my flusher pole is not professional...but what if my knockdown looks better, would you buy knockdown cardboard from all wall for 60 bucks:whistling2:


Exactly! Do what works for you!
I most likely wouldn't buy your cardboard knockdown pole, but that's just because I'm happy with what works for me.



charlesdumar said:


> Ok I will post some knockdown videos. Just trying to set the guy up for success. If you brought a six inch knife to knockdown the ceilings of the house we sprayed yesterday you would still be there knocking down. That chit doesn't fly in these parts.


I don't care what flies where. That's why there's more than one way of transportation.

But sure, do what this guy suggests. Here you go GetPlastered!
Have at er!







http://www.walltools.com/marshalltown-36-knockdown-knife.html

Instead of screwing up a 6" section, go ahead, use a 3'ft blade and screw up half the ceiling! At least you looked like a pro when doing it!

He clearly stated "I am not an experience spray texture guy", but sure...instead of taking things slow and choosing quality over quantity, go ahead, use the biggest blade you can find and do it as fast as you can! :thumbsup:

Here! Just screw a pole to the back of this, I hear this works really well too.








Meanwhile, when you're waiting for your blade to come in the mail, take a look at the results you can expect when you take your time.


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## charlesdumar

Homeowners wouldn't even use a 6" knife. knockdown blade= quality Sorry if I hurt your feelings. A knockdown blade will last 15 years so thats 4 dollars a year if they are 60 dollars.


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## PrecisionTaping

charlesdumar said:


> Homeowners wouldn't even use a 6" knife. knockdown blade= quality Sorry if I hurt your feelings. A knockdown blade will last 15 years so thats 4 dollars a year if they are 60 dollars.


Ah, who cares about my feelings 
and who cares what the cost of the blade is.
The point I'm trying to make is that he stated he's inexperienced.
And there's more than one way of finishing a knockdown.
I had a knockdown knife and personally I wasn't comfortable using it...It just didn't produce the same look as all my other ceilings.

Didn't like it at all. I tried using it for 3 houses and I'm not going to lie, in my eyes they were the worse knockdown's I've ever done.
You know why? Because they most likely will look exactly like yours. You and 90% of the rest of the world who does them the same way.

I just don't like the look they give. I spray my knockdown's pretty thick and I think I have a pretty even drag effect. I find they just look fuller and tighter.
I've seen some butchered knockdown's over the years.
I'm just saying, get the experience, then get the speed.
Don't jump right into speed without the experience.

There's more than one way to skin a cat.

With that being said, I appreciate and value your opinion. :thumbsup:


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## chris

I should be spraying a small remod/addittion sometime next week...if I have time and there are no probs with filming a short clip ( church high school) . I will be matching a light op thats in the existing but I will try to goober up a wall for a KD vid:jester:


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## DLSdrywall

charlesdumar said:


> Ok I will post some knockdown videos. Just trying to set the guy up for success. If you brought a six inch knife to knockdown the ceilings of the house we sprayed yesterday you would still be there knocking down. That chit doesn't fly in these parts.


Seems the only thing flying in these parts is piles and piles of sheep chit


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## Tim0282

Brian, you just gained a lot of respect in my eyes! And I already had a lot of respect for you. :thumbsup:


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## 2buckcanuck

PrecisionTaping said:


> No worries bro.
> Knockdown's are easy stuff.
> My hopper's been stuck on the 2nd biggest setting for ever.
> The little screw just kind'a rusted in place, so my knockdown's are always on that setting. lol.
> I always spray my ceilings in layers. I know some guys just fill it all in thick as they go. I don't do that. I do one light pass over the whole ceiling. Just cover the whole are. So for my first pass, i'll do like a quick left to right and cover everything. After that, for my second pass I change directions and will spray front to back sort of thing. My second pass is the one I spray a little slower because I fill in a little more, get that nice uniform spray.
> If it's a big ceiling I do the same process but after the whole ceilings done I just run back to wherever I started and give a really fast and light spray just to make sure it's not drying up on me.
> Then I tear down all my poly, scrape the sides of the wall, fill my staple holes, and in between doing all of that, I will check a little corner every now and then to make sure it's not setting up too quick.
> Just check where you first started. Use a small knife like a 6" at first just to see if it's setup enough.
> 
> I actually use a 6" to wipe my entire ceiling.
> I know allot of guys will laugh at that, but all the contractors in town like my knockdown's the best compared to other company's. They don't know what I do differently. haha. I just use a 6" knife. I find you have more control. I see allot of guys use the wider knockdown knives and they get crappy results because it flattens out too much at a time. If they happen to go across a butt joint, thy flatten out too much of it and you can tell there's a noticeable hump. Seen it a hundred times.
> Laugh all you want. I like my 6" knife for knocking down.
> Ceilings look perfect every time.


This is the biggest WTF post I have read yet:blink:

You got the second biggest hole right, after that:blink:

What your trying to describe is a cross hatch, and a 6" knife


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## Tim0282

When knockdown first started in this area of the world, (probably 20 years ago) I used a 6 inch and a ten inch knife. Jumped on my stilts and went like a wild man. Usually sprayed the bedrooms and bathrooms, scraped the walls and got on stilts and knocked down. I have been back in those houses. It looks great, still. Sprayed with a hopper. Worked by myself. Had to do a lot of hustling to keep ahead of the mud. I had less errors using the ten inch knife than we do now using the 20 inch rubber kinfe. Whatever works for you and you get paid and the customer is happy, you are the pro. Just can't say another guy is not a pro because he does it different than you. Now that is not professional!:no:


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## DLSdrywall

PT let me put it to you this way, I started this trade when i was 21, i knew nothing about drywall, could barely hammer a nail without hurting myself. Look at how much you can do at a young age if i was in your position at your age i would have started my own drywall company. As much as we bug you and make fun of you, your very accomplished. One day you'll look back where you are now and say..." I can't believe i didn't rough sand" HAHAHA!!!:jester:


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## PrecisionTaping

chris said:


> I should be spraying a small remod/addittion sometime next week...if I have time and there are no probs with filming a short clip ( church high school) . I will be matching a light op thats in the existing but I will try to goober up a wall for a KD vid:jester:


Ya that would be cool Chris!



DLSdrywall said:


> Seems the only thing flying in these parts is piles and piles of sheep chit


Hahaha! Sheep...
If he does post a video, I look forward to seeing it. I'm sure his knockdown's look great.
They just don't look like mine.
Not to say that mine are better, I just find they stand apart from others.



Tim0282 said:


> Brian, you just gained a lot of respect in my eyes! And I already had a lot of respect for you. :thumbsup:


Thanks Tim! That's very nice of you! 
I don't know what I did to deserve it, but thanks. lol



2buckcanuck said:


> This is the biggest WTF post I have read yet:blink:
> 
> You got the second biggest hole right, after that
> 
> What your trying to describe is a cross hatch, and a 6" knife


Okay what? What's the problem here 2buck? Other than I'm using a 6" to wipe? Which I already stated in my comment that I knew was different and that some of you guys would laugh...
way to stand out of the crowd 2buck.


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## smisner50s

2buckcanuck said:


> This is the biggest WTF post I have read yet:blink:
> 
> You got the second biggest hole right, after that:blink:
> 
> What your trying to describe is a cross hatch, and a 6" knife


6 inch does work good


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## PrecisionTaping

Tim0282 said:


> When knockdown first started in this area of the world, (probably 20 years ago) I used a 6 inch and a ten inch knife. Jumped on my stilts and went like a wild man. Usually sprayed the bedrooms and bathrooms, scraped the walls and got on stilts and knocked down. I have been back in those houses. It looks great, still. Sprayed with a hopper. Worked by myself. Had to do a lot of hustling to keep ahead of the mud. I had less errors using the ten inch knife than we do now using the 20 inch rubber kinfe. Whatever works for you and you get paid and the customer is happy, you are the pro. Just can't say another guy is not a pro because he does it different than you. Now that is not professional!:no:


Good post Tim!
And I did that too for a bit! Using two knives.
I tried giving a wide knockdown blade a chance. Enough that I would do the whole ceiling with it and then go back and use my 6" in the spots I wasn't happy with.
But I just really wasn't happy with the over all look. I found it would have been faster doing the whole thing with my 6" anyways.
So I do. I've been doing it like that for the last 3 years.
Even my main guy now, he tried using a knockdown knife and immediately said the same thing "It doesn't look the same!"
Knockdown's are probably one of my favourite things to do. I love the way they look. It's actually the only design my company does.



DLSdrywall said:


> PT let me put it to you this way, I started this trade when i was 21, i knew nothing about drywall, could barely hammer a nail without hurting myself. Look at how much you can do at a young age if i was in your position at your age i would have started my own drywall company. As much as we bug you and make fun of you, your very accomplished. One day you'll look back where you are now and say..." I can't believe i didn't rough sand" HAHAHA!!!:jester:


Hahaha! How did I know you were going to say that!
And thanks for the compliment man! :thumbsup:


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## 2buckcanuck

Tim0282 said:


> When knockdown first started in this area of the world, (probably 20 years ago) I used a 6 inch and a ten inch knife. Jumped on my stilts and went like a wild man. Usually sprayed the bedrooms and bathrooms, scraped the walls and got on stilts and knocked down. I have been back in those houses. It looks great, still. Sprayed with a hopper. Worked by myself. Had to do a lot of hustling to keep ahead of the mud. I had less errors using the ten inch knife than we do now using the 20 inch rubber kinfe. Whatever works for you and you get paid and the customer is happy, you are the pro. Just can't say another guy is not a pro because he does it different than you. Now that is not professional!:no:


But we have EVOLVED since then:whistling2:

Here's a old thread with some KD blades http://www.drywalltalk.com/f8/need-knock-down-knife-1921/

It may not help get plastered right away, but down the road maybe when he does more spray. But yes for now, if he has a 12" knife or trowel he can use, stainless steel would be nice also.

check to see if your trowel bends up wards towards handle (most old ones do), less chances of leaving lines. same with a knife, if it has a tiny bend in it.........:yes:


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## PrecisionTaping

2buckcanuck said:


> But we have EVOLVED since then:whistling2:
> 
> Here's a old thread with some KD blades http://www.drywalltalk.com/f8/need-knock-down-knife-1921/
> 
> It may not help get plastered right away, but down the road maybe when he does more spray. But yes for now, if he has a 12" knife or trowel he can use, stainless steel would be nice also.
> 
> check to see if your trowel bends up wards towards handle (most old ones do), less chances of leaving lines. same with a knife, if it has a tiny bend in it.........:yes:


:blink: There's only 8 posts in that whole thread?
We already covered more in this thread than that entire one...

The only valuable piece of info in that thread is this link
http://www.hardmansystems.com/products/knockdownknives/


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## PrecisionTaping

2buckcanuck said:


> It may not help get plastered right away, but down the road maybe when he does more spray.


And see, you said it yourself, a big blade might not help GetPlastered right away. That's all I was trying to get across as well.
I already knew my way of doing things wasn't the norm.
I expected the response I got.
I want his ceiling to look professional! I don't want HIM to look professional while he does a crappy design!


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## smisner50s

The way i see it a big kbockdown blade is a production tool gets alot done fast quality is sacraficed...a 6 inch blade is more for the quality orenated person slower but top notch finsh ...


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## 2buckcanuck

PrecisionTaping said:


> And see, you said it yourself, a big blade might not help GetPlastered right away. That's all I was trying to get across as well.
> I already knew my way of doing things wasn't the norm.
> I expected the response I got.
> I want his ceiling to look professional! I don't want HIM to look professional while he does a crappy design!


The tools I mentioned are tools he should have at hand, and they are bigger than a 6" knife. And your PREFERRED ways of doing things, do not translate to the best Bang for the buck. No home owner is going to say to another HO, my ceilings look better than yours, b/c a 6" knife was used.


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## PrecisionTaping

2buckcanuck said:


> The tools I mentioned are tools he should have at hand, and they are bigger than a 6" knife. And your PREFERRED ways of doing things, do not translate to the best Bang for the buck. No home owner is going to say to another HO, my ceilings look better than yours, b/c a 6" knife was used.


And what point have I mentioned anything about money? How is this at all money related? Or best bang for your buck?
Simply put, he's not experienced, he shouldn't use a massive blade.
Use what he's comfortable to work with.

And you're right, no home owner is going to say to another HO, my ceilings look better than yours, b/c a 6" knife was used.

They're going to say my ceilings look better than yours because we hired Precision Taping!


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## smisner50s

No a home owner wont say that...buttt another tradesmen looking around being picke might..


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## 2buckcanuck

Here's a few pointers Get plastered

your from Ontario, most paint the ceiling 1st
Buy a actual KD spray if you can (cgc red can work too though)
Mix it runny as hell, more than Bazooka mud
sounds like your using a air compressor (not renting machine) if so........
Keep pressure around 30 pds or under, let tank fill before you start
Only fill hopper up half way or 3/4 full (spray pattern can change, from when it's full to empty)
Start spraying in a corner first, and work your way out.
Spray a pattern about 4 to 5 feet wide, walk backwards.
The steps/spacing you take going back wards, begin to set your pattern
If you know how to do a roll and a half when painting, incorporate that into the system (if you have ran a paint sprayer before, you should have no problems)
Keep windows and doors closed(wind bad) try to maintain same environment/temperature
Fold poly a inch or 2 when you hang it, pulls staples out when you pull on it

hardest part is knowing when to hit it, a lot depends on the weather. This is the hard part to teach. So check near a wall/edge 1st, this you will half to learn on your own, or someone would half to make a vid on that one.............. but once it is ready to wipe down, just go go go, you will find you don't half to be gentle with it, just consistant pressure. You may want to use a cross hatch pattern when you do wipe it down when 1st learning.

Good Luck:thumbup:


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## 2buckcanuck

PrecisionTaping said:


> And what point have I mentioned anything about money? How is this at all money related? Or best bang for your buck?
> Simply put, he's not experienced, he shouldn't use a massive blade.
> Use what he's comfortable to work with.
> 
> And you're right, no home owner is going to say to another HO, my ceilings look better than yours, b/c a 6" knife was used.
> 
> They're going to say my ceilings look better than yours because we hired Precision Taping!


PT, Chris says it all in post #11, he was handed a big KD knife, and was told to do this........

The six inch knife would take talent, not the massive knife as you call it. I could grab some clown off the street to run it.

Guess we only have your word to go by with your last comment


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## Mudslinger

getplastered said:


> I've been very clear that I am not an experience spray texture guy...I have rolled, mopped and knocked down a few times with success, but my gc wants me to match a knockdown done on his old house which was done with a hopper.
> 
> So I bought a hopper....shot it in my garage and knocked it down...which was kinda cool. I guess I'm looking for some pointers before I go and fubar the ceilings in his new house!
> 
> Granted, he said start in the walk ins to get some practice! He knows this will be my first time...what a guy...
> 
> The bedrooms aren't bad...it's the living area...it's huge! How much do I spray before I start knocking down? What setting works best? Where in the room do I start? We will be 2 guys...oh and can I shoot from the floor on a 9 foot ceiling?
> 
> Any I put would be great!


Mix up your mud a little looser than bazooka mud like 2Buck said. I usually mix it loose enough so it will come back together as your running your finger through it. Most the time I run the biggest tip so I get a bigger spray pattern. The bigger the area your covering the easier it is to get a even texture. Air pressures hard to say, it really depends on your mix, and what material your spraying just play with it. We use the lexan knives, because their pretty much fool proof. They wont draw together as bad, and don't leave lines.


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## Mudslinger

One more thing I didn't see brought up is mixing all your texture in a large container(garbage can), or "boxing" your buckets like a painter. On a large ceiling you can see it plain as day if your mix is off on one bucket. Yes you can get it right mixing in buckets most the time, but there always that other time lol!


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## getplastered

Geeze...go to bed and wake up to this sh!t storm this morning! Glad you guys had fun while I got my beauty sleep!


Lots of great tips and pointers...probably gonna start spraying tomorrow and i will let you guys know how it goes!


A big thanks to my drywall brothers on DWT...always there when I need them! :thumbsup:


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## silverstilts

All the talk about using a six inch knife, that is insane.. I am guilty of using a ten inch that is when I first started but found it exasperating to spray then jump up on my stilts to wipe out a ceiling. You don't have to use a wide wipe down blade to do great looking knock down but use some common sense. Another thing is I have one guy that is about 6-7 drives me nuts when he jumps up on his stilts to wipe down a ceiling, really now his head is so close to the ceiling that it is impossible to see what he is doing. Get down to earth so u can look up and get the big picture. A nice light adjustable alum. handle is what I use with a magic trowel, it is only 18" wide and just using a light touch letting it float in your fingers gives a really great job. I have used all kinds of wipe down blades but this is the only one I have found that allows you to feel just how set up the mud is. Another thing that drives me nuts is when someone does a circle around any electrical boxes on the walls or ceilings after wiping the rest in one other direction, wtf who wants a circle pattern on their ceilings.. The homeowners may never see it but I always do it draws my eyes right to that spot and it looks like crap ...


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## PrecisionTaping

silverstilts said:


> Another thing that drives me nuts is when someone does a circle around any electrical boxes on the walls or ceilings after wiping the rest in one other direction, wtf who wants a circle pattern on their ceilings.. The homeowners may never see it but I always do it draws my eyes right to that spot and it looks like crap ...


Hahaha! Yup! I've seen that a bunch of times too!
I seen one knockdown where the guy who did tried to do like an outwards sunburst effect. It was pretty well the worse design I'd ever seen.
Potentially could have worked....but it didn't! It was a huge fail.
He started wiping outwards from the light in the middle of the room, In ever direction. Just gross looking.


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## saskataper

I don't get why you still use staples PT, I use a hand masker with 9" paper then spray glue the poly on, then when I'm done a room just pull it down from the door and that's it no holes to fill and a nice sharp edge.


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## chris

some guys may find it hard to get the tape to stick to the dusty walls:whistling2: . I also use masking, Im not shootin stapels into my angles either


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## PrecisionTaping

saskataper said:


> I don't get why you still use staples PT, I use a hand masker with 9" paper then spray glue the poly on, then when I'm done a room just pull it down from the door and that's it no holes to fill and a nice sharp edge.


Like I said before, I spray my knockdown's pretty heavy, I tried a masker once while I was spraying a big room and about half way through the weight of the mud pulled the tape down and once one little area comes down, the weight of it just follows and pulls the entire room down with it.
Tried it once, and said never again! Try fixing that half way through your ceiling :no: You can't stop...
I just kept spraying! lol. Had no choice! All over my walls. What do you do.
It's just once extra step, doesn't bother me.
Clearly I don't whip through my knockdown's like everyone else apparently does. Doesn't matter to me.
I charge $1000 a day for knockdown.


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## moore

PrecisionTaping said:


> Like I said before, I spray my knockdown's pretty heavy, I tried a masker once while I was spraying a big room and about half way through the weight of the mud pulled the tape down and once one little area comes down, the weight of it just follows and pulls the entire room down with it.
> Tried it once, and said never again! Try fixing that half way through your ceiling :no: You can't stop...
> I just kept spraying! lol. Had no choice! All over my walls. What do you do.
> It's just once extra step, doesn't bother me.
> Clearly I don't whip through my knockdown's like everyone else apparently does. Doesn't matter to me.
> I charge $1000 a day for knockdown.


 AT $1000 A DAY ..You can use your fingernails PT.. I would not bicker with you about at all!

Texture ceilings ..knockdown/skip trowel/pop corn/slap stomp. It's all hard work..A race for time! $1000 a day sounds about right to me.:yes:


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## Tim0282

Brian, are you using premix mud to spray knockdown? 
I have found there is a huge difference in using premix and bag made for knockdown texture. Needs to be mixed the day before to soak together, but it so worth it. Just my opinion.


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## Mudshark

Tim0282 said:


> Brian, are you using premix mud to spray knockdown?
> I have found there is a huge difference in using premix and bag made for knockdown texture. Needs to be mixed the day before to soak together, but it so worth it. Just my opinion.


Agree with that Tim0282 :thumbsup:


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## PrecisionTaping

Tim0282 said:


> Brian, are you using premix mud to spray knockdown?
> I have found there is a huge difference in using premix and bag made for knockdown texture. Needs to be mixed the day before to soak together, but it so worth it. Just my opinion.


Just use regular MachineMud.







Use it for everything I do.

I don't even know if my supplier carries bags for knockdown texture :blink:
And really? Needs to be mixed the day before? 
That means when I'd do a house I'd have to have like 10 pails pre-mixed the day before!?


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## getplastered

PrecisionTaping said:


> Just use regular MachineMud.
> View attachment 5402
> 
> Use it for everything I do.
> 
> I don't even know if my supplier carries bags for knockdown texture :blink:
> And really? Needs to be mixed the day before?
> That means when I'd do a house I'd have to have like 10 pails pre-mixed the day before!?


That's what il be using!


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## 2buckcanuck

getplastered said:


> That's what il be using!


Well, hoping you read this in the morning getplastered

We have guys in the company who do spray (KD) everyday, it's their job full time. Most use the CGC red, with the words WHITE stamped on the side, it's cheaper for them since they supply. You can get the pre-mixed KD spray but it's about 5 more bucks a box. The machine mud has a yellow tinge to it, but you would not notice unless you had the two muds side by side. The pre-mixed KD muds do apply on nice. When I half to do spray, thats what I use........

I also missed you post #7, that you bought a magic trowel, so all is good there.:thumbup:,,,, some certain posts threw my mind off track:whistling2:

Also, on your way out the door in the morning, when your wife is not looking,,,, steal the Milk container, it's great for filling up the hopper:thumbup:


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## 2buckcanuck

PrecisionTaping said:


> I charge $1000 a day for knockdown.


2bjr and I shall be moving to Sudbury this spring:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::yes:


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## Mudshark

PrecisionTaping said:


> Just use regular MachineMud.
> View attachment 5402
> 
> Use it for everything I do.
> 
> I don't even know if my supplier carries bags for knockdown texture :blink:
> And really? Needs to be mixed the day before?
> That means when I'd do a house I'd have to have like 10 pails pre-mixed the day before!?


PT - check your work in a couple of years and you may see that the ceiling has yellowed by using that mud. You can "cheap out" and get away with it but watch out for complaints down the road. 

And if you are doing your spraying in the afternoon you can mix it in the morning.

Just my 5cents worth.


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## PrecisionTaping

Mudshark said:


> PT - check your work in a couple of years and you may see that the ceiling has yellowed by using that mud. You can "cheap out" and get away with it but watch out for complaints down the road.
> 
> And if you are doing your spraying in the afternoon you can mix it in the morning.
> 
> Just my 5cents worth.


Haven't had any problems yet but I will keep an open mind. :thumbsup:


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## Tim0282

We paint over all of the knockdown around here. So color is no issue.
The bag mud is worth the mixing ahead of time. Flows so much better through the sprayer or hopper. Then again, I have not used your brand of mud. So reality is, I am speaking out of line. :yes:


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## bmitch

PrecisionTaping said:


> Hahaha! Yup! I've seen that a bunch of times too!
> I seen one knockdown where the guy who did tried to do like an outwards sunburst effect. It was pretty well the worse design I'd ever seen.
> Potentially could have worked....but it didn't! It was a huge fail.
> He started wiping outwards from the light in the middle of the room, In ever direction. Just gross looking.


 this sunburst look can be very effective when done well .i would limit it to only small square rooms 12x12,14x14,no rectangular rooms.i,ve always drawn from a ring that i built around the light,in addition i would have a large border.different times i've used paper bullnose flat on the ceiling as a perimeter molding.the more confined the textured area is the more impact it has.


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## bmitch

i have to say that as a decorative feature ,knockdown in large areas is just as boring as popcorn tex unless you can break it up somehow.boring ,boring ,boring.


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## SlimPickins

b said:


> i have to say that as a decorative feature ,knockdown in large areas is just as boring as popcorn tex unless you can break it up somehow.boring ,boring ,boring.


:thumbup:


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## Tim0282

As boring as smooth. As boring as orange peel. As boring as stomp. As boring as...


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## getplastered

2buckcanuck said:


> Well, hoping you read this in the morning getplastered
> 
> We have guys in the company who do spray (KD) everyday, it's their job full time. Most use the CGC red, with the words WHITE stamped on the side, it's cheaper for them since they supply. You can get the pre-mixed KD spray but it's about 5 more bucks a box. The machine mud has a yellow tinge to it, but you would not notice unless you had the two muds side by side. The pre-mixed KD muds do apply on nice. When I half to do spray, thats what I use........
> 
> Also, on your way out the door in the morning, when your wife is not looking,,,, steal the Milk container, it's great for filling up the hopper:thumbup:


2buck; I don't have that option of mud here....only machine, cgc red, or cgc light green that weighs 80lbs a box...


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## getplastered

Heading out after lunch to tape off a couple rooms...yeehaw!


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## getplastered

getplastered said:


> Heading out after lunch to tape off a couple rooms...yeehaw!


I mean plastic off....ugh...long night...:blink:


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## PrecisionTaping

getplastered said:


> 2buck; I don't have that option of mud here....only machine, cgc red, or cgc light green that weighs 80lbs a box...


Machine Mud is the best in my opinion. 
I find it dries the whitest out of all the muds.
Nice and easy to work with.



getplastered said:


> I mean plastic off....ugh...long night...:blink:


Goodluck bro!!


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## saskataper

Do you guys not get Span-Lite out there?


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## PrecisionTaping

saskataper said:


> Do you guys not get Span-Lite out there?


Never heard of it...


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## bmitch

Tim0282 said:


> As boring as smooth. As boring as orange peel. As boring as stomp. As boring as...


 yes.i think knockdown's as boring as everything else unless you can limit the amount of coverage within a large area.say the room is 16x24,cut it in half ,do 8x12 area ,scallop the corners.in my opinion less is better and you'll actually look at it.do the whole room and i won't even look at it.


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## bmitch

saskataper said:


> Do you guys not get Span-Lite out there?


 i,ve never seen it in this region,but in the 70's we used it in powder form.span tex.dries very white and alot harder than most products.we mixed it in with our ceiling textures for that reason.at that time we also used for a feature wall app.(knockdown).


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## PrecisionTaping

b said:


> yes.i think knockdown's as boring as everything else unless you can limit the amount of coverage within a large area.say the room is 16x24,cut it in half ,do 8x12 area ,scallop the corners.in my opinion less is better and you'll actually look at it.do the whole room and i won't even look at it.


Good idea Bernie.
I like your outside the box thinking. :thumbsup:


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## getplastered

Well, we did two walk ins and the master...overall looks pretty cool. I tried to take a pic but my phone was dead.

the first walk in I wasn't uniform enough...little heavy in spots so a little thicker texture. The key is even...Might take some time. The second walk in we did turned out awesome! I thought this is cake!

For the two walk ins, I used a twelve inch magic trowel...it worked great.

Then we shot the master...and I used the 24 inch mt...probably not the best idea...I turned in stroke a couple times and you could see the the texture flare...couple really heavy spots and a couple light spots. 

Gotta even that spray...guess that's where the experience will come in...not sure if I have the best hopper either. Still cool nonetheless.

And I was expecting to be able to wait a lot longer before knocking down....by the time I finished spraying the room I had to got back and knockdown...and by the time that was done, I was tough to cut out the border cause the mud was setting up...

Anyway, gonna try another bedroom and bathroom tomorrow....hopefully I can get some pics...thanks again for the input...


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## getplastered

b said:


> yes.i think knockdown's as boring as everything else unless you can limit the amount of coverage within a large area.say the room is 16x24,cut it in half ,do 8x12 area ,scallop the corners.in my opinion less is better and you'll actually look at it.do the whole room and i won't even look at it.


What is scalloping the corners?

That was the other hard part...he wanted it square around the outside 90's...tough to free hand that.


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## SlimPickins

Tim0282 said:


> As boring as smooth. As boring as orange peel. As boring as stomp. As boring as...


:thumbup:


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## PrecisionTaping

getplastered said:


> What is scalloping the corners?
> 
> That was the other hard part...he wanted it square around the outside 90's...tough to free hand that.


Oh?..you gave him a border?
I just go wall to wall with my knockdown's.
I've never done a border on one yet.


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## 2buckcanuck

getplastered said:


> 2buck; I don't have that option of mud here....only machine, cgc red, or cgc light green that weighs 80lbs a box...


I think I confused you........
On the latest cgc red boxes we have been getting, they now have the words WHITE on the side of the box. Just one of those things you notice when drinking coffee one day, and you go "hey, when did they start doing that??" So my assumption is their pushing/advertising the mud for potential KD service, since the cgc reps would know a lot of tapers/spray guys use it for that already.

Having to get stuck using the cgc products a lot, I can tell you this much, the green dries grey in colour, the red is pure white, while the Machine mud is yellow in colour. We personally put a few scoops of Machine mud in with the cgc red when using it, to turn it into a more topping type mud. So we see the colour difference almost everyday, unless we get the mud we prefer,,,,,,certainteed



getplastered said:


> we shot the master...and I used the 24 inch mt...probably not the best idea...I turned in stroke a couple times and you could see the the texture flare...couple really heavy spots and a couple light spots.


I watch our guys spray in a lot, so I pick up a few pointers from them. If they over spray a spot too much, they will avoid doing that spot for a bit, and come back to wipe it down later. Just something that will come to you with more jobs under your belt, you will skip that one 2x2 spot, b/c you will know:yes:



getplastered said:


> What is scalloping the corners?
> 
> That was the other hard part...he wanted it square around the outside 90's...tough to free hand that.


Just wondering how you did that, theres a few different ways so....


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## bmitch

getplastered said:


> What is scalloping the corners?
> 
> That was the other hard part...he wanted it square around the outside 90's...tough to free hand that.


 when doing borders,i'll wipe a half circle into the inside corners.depth of border determines the diameter of half circle.i cut and notch a small piece of drywall for my knife to sit in to wipe in an accurate semicircle.


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## getplastered

2buckcanuck said:


> Just wondering how you did that, theres a few different ways so....


I free handed it...was so so...

He wants the main living area without border...yay


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## getplastered

So I went back to the house today...the stuff we did yesterday looked great!

So pick up the hopper and bang off the second bedroom, the bathroom and the entrance...I mixed my mud a little thinner to see if it would spray different....now I find that the texture is way to light in the two rooms I did tonight...can I respray once that's dry or do I need to sand it down and redo? Ugh, I don't feel like sanding it...

They're small rooms thank god...


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## Tim0282

Spraying over them after dry will work. Gives you more depth.


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## PrecisionTaping

getplastered said:


> So I went back to the house today...the stuff we did yesterday looked great!
> 
> So pick up the hopper and bang off the second bedroom, the bathroom and the entrance...I mixed my mud a little thinner to see if it would spray different....now I find that the texture is way to light in the two rooms I did tonight...can I respray once that's dry or do I need to sand it down and redo? Ugh, I don't feel like sanding it...
> 
> They're small rooms thank god...





Tim0282 said:


> Spraying over them after dry will work. Gives you more depth.


Tim's right, you can spray over them and it will add a little more depth but be careful, you won't have the same setup time as before.
Your mud not's drying on a sealed painted surface anymore. It will be drying on mud, so you're existing dried texture will quickly start to suck the moisture out of your new spray, causing it to set up faster.
Mud over mud right. So just check your dry time as soon as your done spraying.
Just be weary of that. But if they're small rooms like you said, you should be good!


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## getplastered

Here's a couple pics I took today of the rooms we did yesterday...


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## PrecisionTaping

Looks good to me!! Pretty easy eh? :thumbsup:


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## getplastered

PrecisionTaping said:


> Looks good to me!! Pretty easy eh? :thumbsup:


Once I get the consistency "consistent", il be good...lol.

Kinda worried about the living area....it's so big I'm afraid to mess it up???

We're gonna spray it tomorrow night...


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## PrecisionTaping

getplastered said:


> Once I get the consistency "consistent", il be good...lol.
> 
> Kinda worried about the living area....it's so big I'm afraid to mess it up???
> 
> We're gonna spray it tomorrow night...


No worries bro. What are you worried about?
Setting up too fast? Or just because it's big and shows more?


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## getplastered

PrecisionTaping said:


> No worries bro. What are you worried about?
> Setting up too fast? Or just because it's big and shows more?


Ya mostly setting up too fast, buckets of mud not same consistency and getting different texture I guess....


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## PrecisionTaping

getplastered said:


> Ya mostly setting up too fast, buckets of mud not same consistency and getting different texture I guess....


Just do like I said, after you sprayed the whole thing just go back where you started and do a really fast fly by. Just swinging the hopper back and forth, just getting a really light spray on everything, so fast that you're not really adding any texture, it's just spraying like really really thin mud. Just to keep it wet where you started. Gives you a little more time.


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## getplastered

Boo yay....got the big living area done tonight...took 2 hours with most of that being prep.

Looks awesome...had plenty of time to go back and trowel...very wet and humid I guess played a part.

Thanks again for the pointers!


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## PrecisionTaping

getplastered said:


> Boo yay....got the big living area done tonight...took 2 hours with most of that being prep.
> 
> Looks awesome...had plenty of time to go back and trowel...very wet and humid I guess played a part.
> 
> Thanks again for the pointers!


Right on buddy! Glad it went well!


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