# Hot Mud in Auto Tools?



## Paulie (Aug 27, 2011)

Had a couple of people tell me to come over here and ask this question. I don't post much here but am a DWT stalker.

Anyways, I see a Columbia set with a "hot mud" pump. Columbia Set

I've always wondered if some guys ran hot mud in tubes or tools in general. I don't run production, rather looking to run a basement or addition with tools. With the smaller sqft. I am thinking I could run a couple of coats in one day. Pipe dream?

I hear there is a new zooka with a detachable head but I already have one and with all the thousands of tiny parts I don't have the guts to fill with setting mud. Tubes and flushers are another story tho.


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Homax banjo, Tubes, mudheads, flushers/angleheads, Quickfill pump, Boxes etc is what you want, Even these are not worth it if its a smaller job, Bazookas and pumps a bit of a hassel unless its a bigger job and there is 2 or 3 of you. Its a bit much on your own, I set my zooka and pump and gooseneck in hotmud once, sheetrock 210 went off in after 90min, really fast, What a , took me ages to clean it out.


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## Collin (Dec 22, 2011)

cazna said:


> Homax banjo, Tubes, mudheads, flushers/angleheads, Quickfill pump, Boxes etc is what you want, Even these are not worth it if its a smaller job, Bazookas and pumps a bit of a hassel unless its a bigger job and there is 2 or 3 of you. Its a bit much on your own, I set my zooka and pump and gooseneck in hotmud once, sheetrock 210 went off in after 90min, really fast, What a , took me ages to clean it out.


Hot mud went off before it time, has it happen to anyone else, just wondering if was just a one time thing like lighting striking twice in the same spot


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Collin said:


> Hot mud went off before it time, has it happen to anyone else, just wondering if was just a one time thing like lighting striking twice in the same spot


RUCO hot mud will set 10 min. before bag time says.
RUCO 90 sets in 45 min
45 sets in 30
20 sets in 15 ....No matter the water or the way you mix It sets fast.


Ruco products are bottom of the barrel dollar store trash/junk/!


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## Paulie (Aug 27, 2011)

I work with hot mud (setting type) quite a bit. There are different factors that make it go off faster than the time on the bag. The biggest we've found is contamination from old to new batch. Also temp of water used to mix and I've found that well water seems to make it go off faster but have no clue why.

It's nice putting all three coats on in one day tho.


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## PrecisionTaping (Feb 2, 2012)

Paulie said:


> I work with hot mud (setting type) quite a bit. There are different factors that make it go off faster than the time on the bag. The biggest we've found is contamination from old to new batch. Also temp of water used to mix and I've found that well water seems to make it go off faster but have no clue why.
> 
> It's nice putting all three coats on in one day tho.


Yup! You're absolutely right.
Warm water can almost cut your time in half. But ya, dirty water will do it too. If your mixing a 2nd batch in the same pail, make sure the pail is really clean from the previous batch. Residue left over from the previous batch will off balance your new chemical mix and cause it to dry quicker.


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## Collin (Dec 22, 2011)

I like ProRoc Lite
does anyone know what the differences is with Durabond and sheetrock there both made by CGC so.......... :blink:


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## Collin (Dec 22, 2011)

PrecisionTaping said:


> Yup! You're absolutely right.
> Warm water can almost cut your time in half. But ya, dirty water will do it too. If your mixing a 2nd batch in the same pail, make sure the pail is really clean from the previous batch. Residue left over from the previous batch will off balance your new chemical mix and cause it to dry quicker.


ooo good to know thank:thumbsup: Paulie & PrecisionTaping


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## Paulie (Aug 27, 2011)

PrecisionTaping said:


> Yup! You're absolutely right.
> Warm water can almost cut your time in half. But ya, dirty water will do it too. If your mixing a 2nd batch in the same pail, make sure the pail is really clean from the previous batch. Residue left over from the previous batch will off balance your new chemical mix and cause it to dry quicker.


Also dipping a cup or whatever into your new water will contaminate. Even dust during mixing will fall in new water screwing it up. We use a camping type water container that has a spigot now for that reason. Works great.



Collin said:


> I like ProRoc Lite
> does anyone know what the differences is with Durabond and sheetrock there both made by CGC so.......... :blink:


Durobond or as we call it "brown bag" is a shade off of concrete and don't even think about sanding it. We use it for basement posts where kids are likely to run into it with toys for filler. Then go over with easy sand and topping.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

All my buckets are clean ,but this time of year the water is cold.
The perfect atmosphere for mixing hot mud is impossible..
stay-smooth is the best hot mud out there...sheet rock brand is good also ..
but no hot mud is sandable IMO..



3 coats in 1 day don't work. It's fast setting..not fast drying..when finishing drywall each coat needs to completely CURE before the next pass.


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## Philma Crevices (Jan 28, 2012)

Hotmud in boxes and pumps is fine, i'd recomend 90 for your first time (like a virgin ) Easy clean pump for sure. Need to have a good water source for cleanout though. Theres a post in Drywall Tools to make a nice little cleanout station


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## Paulie (Aug 27, 2011)

moore said:


> All my buckets are clean ,but this time of year the water is cold.
> The perfect atmosphere for mixing hot mud is impossible..
> stay-smooth is the best hot mud out there...sheet rock brand is good also ..
> but no hot mud is sandable IMO..
> ...


I agree, the set is a chemical process, the drying only is complete when the water leaves the mix. But putting another coat over a previous one after it's set up but before the water is evaporated is acceptable IMO.

Hot mud sanding is a PITA. I agree.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Paulie ..each to his own...But what to hell is that on your avatar???:blink:


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## Paulie (Aug 27, 2011)

moore said:


> Paulie ..each to his own...But what to hell is that on your avatar???:blink:


Yeah, everyone has there own ways. Kinda funny.

Oh yeah, the avatar. That's Peter Gabriel in his younger days. LOL


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## Philma Crevices (Jan 28, 2012)

3 coats same day is always a pita, but its do-able. I do alot of our pickup work, 2 coats of 5 min if needed and a tight skim of reg. We don't sand hotmud, always scrape with a 6"


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## suncoast drywaller (Sep 4, 2009)

*Hot mud*

I always use hot mud for the first two coats .I use the zooka to run tapes in on flat joins and have never had a problem . I use the drywallmaster king taper with easy removable end and do not use gooseneck on my pump , just hold it up to valve and fill . The secret is to know when the mud is going to go off and cleaning up say about ten minuites befor this time . Take a note of the time when you mix the mud , Make sure water is clean , and make sure you have wash up area all ready to go and have good water pressure . Its also esential to have a helper to wipe down behind you. I have been a long time user of a homax banjo but find the zooker so much quicker :thumbup:


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

I was using sheetrock 210 when i first got the tools, It needs a mash as it starts to firm, Not set, just firm up, Its a bit of a hassel, Away, i prob used 15 bags or so, Till one day i mixed some, Clean bucket, cold water, Same as always, I started taping and 90mins in it firmed up a bit more than normal, Then i realise it was setting, Oh crap, By the time i got outside to the hose it was set Solid, Zooka had about 8 inches in it, pump and goose neck were full, Took nearly 4 hrs of poking with a wire to break it out, The gooseneck took many days of soaking and poking with a wire, I was going to just get another gooseneck, but they were $650 at the time so i kept at it, It cleaned out in the end.

Something i have noticed with hotmud and zookas/tubes is when you fill and empty and fill the first mud around the plungers dosnt get used, It seems to set up, So when you come to clean up its like a hard plug, Or with the tubes it makes hotmud stones that bung it up when your trying to run them, So you need to take off the cone and sort it out, Or have a bucket of water and plunge it every fill, But you cant do that with a zooka, I guess you could hose it every fill, But thats time, You need two people for hotmud zooka, that were the homax is great, Set hotmud comes off the plastic.

Hot mud tends to leave a build up, even when you wash up, Like on a hawk, Hey Suncoast, Whats the inside of your DM tube like, I would pick its all lined with hotmud residue, Your hotmuds may wash up better, What brand are you running??


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## Jason (Feb 27, 2011)

cazna said:


> I was using sheetrock 210 when i first got the tools, It needs a mash as it starts to firm, Not set, just firm up, Its a bit of a hassel, Away, i prob used 15 bags or so, Till one day i mixed some, Clean bucket, cold water, Same as always, I started taping and 90mins in it firmed up a bit more than normal, Then i realise it was setting, Oh crap, By the time i got outside to the hose it was set Solid, Zooka had about 8 inches in it, pump and goose neck were full, Took nearly 4 hrs of poking with a wire to break it out, The gooseneck took many days of soaking and poking with a wire, I was going to just get another gooseneck, but they were $650 at the time so i kept at it, It cleaned out in the end.
> 
> Something i have noticed with hotmud and zookas/tubes is when you fill and empty and fill the first mud around the plungers dosnt get used, It seems to set up, So when you come to clean up its like a hard plug, Or with the tubes it makes hotmud stones that bung it up when your trying to run them, So you need to take off the cone and sort it out, Or have a bucket of water and plunge it every fill, But you cant do that with a zooka, I guess you could hose it every fill, But thats time, You need two people for hotmud zooka, that were the homax is great, Set hotmud comes off the plastic.
> 
> Hot mud tends to leave a build up, even when you wash up, Like on a hawk, Hey Suncoast, Whats the inside of your DM tube like, I would pick its all lined with hotmud residue, Your hotmuds may wash up better, What brand are you running??


I'd guess that the sliding action of the head in the tube would mechanically precipitate setting, and the frictional heat would contribute. That would in turn kick off nucleation of the mud nearby on top of the head. It's never pushed out of the tube so it gets to just hang out there and get chunky.


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Jason said:


> I'd guess that the sliding action of the head in the tube would mechanically precipitate setting, and the frictional heat would contribute. That would in turn kick off nucleation of the mud nearby on top of the head. It's never pushed out of the tube so it gets to just hang out there and get chunky.


:blink:Nice explaination Mr Science Teacher, Sounds like your right, Thats exactly what it does, Gets chunky, And breaks off in lumps which clogs the tube, so off has to come the head for a clean out.:yes:


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## Jason (Feb 27, 2011)

Salt is an accelerant. Maybe someone's been peeing in your zooka.


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## Paulie (Aug 27, 2011)

I know that hot mud film well. :furious:

I've always thought there has to be a chemical to clean it up and dissolve it. It looks similar to lime scale to me. I have several pans that have quite a bit. Maybe today I'll see if CLR or something will break it up. That film build up is the biggest problem I hadn't thought about...... that and it setting up in the tools of course. 

Thanks.


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## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

Paulie said:


> I know that hot mud film well. :furious:
> 
> I've always thought there has to be a chemical to clean it up and dissolve it. It looks similar to lime scale to me. I have several pans that have quite a bit. Maybe today I'll see if CLR or something will break it up.


Maybe Aaron from Columbia Tools might know. On their website, All-Wall says the Columbia hot mud pump is supposed to be able to be used for hot mud:

_*Marshalltown by Columbia Taping Tools "Hot Mud" Pump *The "Hot Mud" designation refers to the quick release pump tube configuration. Easy clean up makes it possible to run hot mud or fast set compounds through the Columbia Taping Tools Hot Mud Pump! _


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## suncoast drywaller (Sep 4, 2009)

fill and empty and fill the first mud around the plungers dosnt get used, It seems to set up, So when you come to clean up its like a hard plug, Or with the tubes it makes hotmud stones that bung it up when your trying to run them, So you need to take off the cone and sort it out, Or have a bucket of water and plunge it every fill, But you cant do that with a zooka, I guess you could hose it every fill, But thats time, You need two people for hotmud zooka, that were the homax is great, Set hotmud comes off the plastic.
o
Hot mud tends to leave a build up, even when you wash up, Like on a hawk, Hey Suncoast, Whats the inside of your DM tube like, I would pick its all lined with hotmud residue, Your hotmuds may wash up better, What brand are you running??[/QUOTE]
You are right caz have had problems with mud residue in the tube , wont run well like this , so I just give it a good wash and scrub with a toilet brush on a long peice of suspended ceiling rod then let dry and give it a blast of zooka oil , this seems to make it run much better . I use knauf which used to be callad Lafage , Longset which goes off in about 70 mins , have never had a problem with this product setting before this time . Over here the other two maufactures both make a base 90 which would be better


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## Collin (Dec 22, 2011)

Hot mud tends to leave a build up, even when you wash up, Like on a hawk, Hey Suncoast, Whats the inside of your DM tube like, I would pick its all lined with hotmud residue, Your hotmuds may wash up better, What brand are you running??[/QUOTE]
You are right caz have had problems with mud residue in the tube , wont run well like this , so I just give it a good wash and scrub with a toilet brush on a long peice of suspended ceiling rod then let dry and give it a blast of zooka oil , this seems to make it run much better . I use knauf which used to be callad Lafage , Longset which goes off in about 70 mins , have never had a problem with this product setting before this time . Over here the other two maufactures both make a base 90 which would be better[/QUOTE]

How often do you clean your tube


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## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

Paulie said:


> I work with hot mud (setting type) quite a bit. There are different factors that make it go off faster than the time on the bag. The biggest we've found is contamination from old to new batch. Also temp of water used to mix and I've found that well water seems to make it go off faster but have no clue why.
> 
> It's nice putting all three coats on in one day tho.


I agree with the contaminants and temp changing the setting times. As for the well water setting it off faster. Could it be that in most places the well water is not treated the same as city water. 

City water is filtered, chlorinated, and in a lot of cases fluoride is added. Also, most homes with wells also have a water softener, if you don't know how they work, they replace most minerals in your water with SALT. Salt from what I'm told acts as an accelerant in your hotmud. 

Who knows what the chlorine and/or fluoride can do to the hotmud. They might not do anything, or they might act as a contaminant and affect the set time.


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## Mudshark (Feb 8, 2009)

I dont use a lot of the hot muds that you guys do but I understood that you need to watch how old the product is. I hear that the older it is the faster it goes off. (unlike a lot of mature men).


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## spacklinfool (Sep 23, 2011)

*hot mud in auto tools*

I am the N.E. distributor for VARIO tapeless compound, and I tried it in my 10 in box on a small job..Only walls 4 seams around the room, then in about 45 minutes, ran the 12 inch box with a quick scrape (just in case)..Well no tape and 2 coats and they came out great, I used the 45 min...and a hose off at the end...wa la!!!!! each to his own...


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