# Paper face metal VS Plastic Corner Beads



## NewB

Which is better overall? thoughts..... advice?


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## Checkers

EVERYONE has their own opinion on this.
Personally, I love No-Coat. But I'm considering switching back to metal for awhile just because I hate the occasional blister and running a slot box.

I love vinyl for patching because it doesn't blister and for bullnose, it's the easiest to sand. However, it worries me how mud pops right off of vinyl.


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## DSJOHN

Paperfaced metal for me----No-coat in all the offset angles.


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## taper71

DSJOHN said:


> Paperfaced metal for me----No-coat in all the offset angles.


Me too, but admit I have only used plastic a few times. I found it harder to manipulate on crooked framing and had to coat it 3 times to get it paint ready. I have met tapers who swear by it and others who hate it. Drywall contractors who swear they do more service calls on plastic bead than paper faced metal. I know its cheaper to buy plastic than paper metal , but Ill stick with paper faced metal until forced otherwise.


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## NewB

Geez, I'm using the plastic and it's giving me some rough patches to fix, it doesn't sit as well the paper face. should I put more nails on it? or I'm even thinking of exchanging em, I've ordered 500 ft in total!!!


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## 2buckcanuck

NewB said:


> Geez, I'm using the plastic and it's giving me some rough patches to fix, it doesn't sit as well the paper face. should I put more nails on it? or I'm even thinking of exchanging em, I've ordered 500 ft in total!!!


uhm.......since your a newb,did you put mud under the paper bead.and you dont nail plastic bead on either


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## NewB

I had to put nails, they're crooked and one side sticks out didn't wanna stick with the mud only. I'm going back to metal, it sticks really good and less mud too..:thumbup:


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## Checkers

Vinyl requires Super 77, or a similar adhesive. Or pneumatically driven staples, which is what most people do.

Also, no one really nails their metal bead either.
Most people either staple it, or clinch it.


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## roominaday

I was using vinyl but went back to paper metal. It is a sharper corner and doesnt flare out the corner as much as vinyl. This is important for your baseboard installation. In my new house I used Trimtex Chamfer beads and 2 of them were smashed hard popping a chunk of mud off! I can't get Nocoat sticks here but when I can I will invest in a roller for it.

I will use NC 325/ 450 for the occasional 90. I use it (NC) if I can't use a paper-metal inside or outside offset. I do like the the vinyl flexible offset angle bead for certain applications it gives a nice line like the NC. 

Vinyl - I glue and staple it 

I use a tube applicator and roller to put on my 90's and inside offset paper metal beads.

I don't like steel.

I Remember when we used to paper tape all inside offsets - glad we have many options!


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## D's

Paper face metal as much as possible
No-Coat for off angles and vaults, or in a bind to save a trip to the store
Only resort to plastic for doing arches and Tear-away trim bead, - staple and glued


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## Capt-sheetrock

D's said:


> Paper face metal as much as possible
> No-Coat for off angles and vaults, or in a bind to save a trip to the store
> Only resort to plastic for doing arches and Tear-away trim bead, - staple and glued


 I do the same:thumbsup:


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## D's

So Capt., do you mix and match when doing an arched opening, vinyl for the arch portion and paper faced for the straight lengths. I always assumed had to keep it the same but it'd be nice to use less vinyl.


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## 2buckcanuck

D's said:


> So Capt., do you mix and match when doing an arched opening, vinyl for the arch portion and paper faced for the straight lengths. I always assumed had to keep it the same but it'd be nice to use less vinyl.


use same bead combination's as you,I find you can use paper bead to line up with the plastic bead,just half to keep the nose even,on arches etc......


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## Capt-sheetrock

2buckcanuck said:


> use same bead combination's as you,I find you can use paper bead to line up with the plastic bead,just half to keep the nose even,on arches etc......


I agree with that 2buck, sure you can use plastic all the way, but its easy enough to line up the plastic arch to the paper-faced legs. The only thing that matters is the line that sticks out of the mud, whats behind the mud, don't matter.:thumbsup:


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## victorydrywall

I'm in love with the HydroTrim. I put it on after the rock is hung and it saves time and materials. If anyone has not tried it, give it a whirl. You may be suprised.


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## D's

I did a bunch of arches today - all vinyl. Staples and glue are a PITA! Next time I'll do the legs with paper faced metal:yes:.


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## 2buckcanuck

D's said:


> I did a bunch of arches today - all vinyl. Staples and glue are a PITA! Next time I'll do the legs with paper faced metal:yes:.


what ,my answer not good enough 
there's other ways to put that vinyl bead on,but i guess you wouldn't be interested:whistling2:


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## D's

If you told me you'd have to kill me right!

Anyone tried the new Trim-tex mud set beads http://www.trim-tex.com/video_MudsetBeads.php? They might have a contender for topling paper faced metal.


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## 2buckcanuck

D's said:


> If you told me you'd have to kill me right!
> 
> Anyone tried the new Trim-tex mud set beads http://www.trim-tex.com/video_MudsetBeads.php? They might have a contender for topling paper faced metal.


nope,I wont half to kill you now,the answer is in your video you posted.that's how we install the bulnose bead in the vid,aplicator/roller with mud,not the bead box.don't like the looks of the 90 bead,too dependent on the rocker leaving a good job.some rockers leave the rock as if they were doing bull nose bead,which gives no strength to the bead.so when they demo those beads (cool job)was there a proper rock job done behind them.
must run our own test ,here on drywall talk:yes:
cazna,got a job/test for you:thumbsup:


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## taper71

I ve used the mud set beads. It really is no different than the normal plastic bead, and for the record I mudded the other plastic bead on as well, no glue or staples.


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## nz drywaller

paper over metal for me,like the sharp edge and less coats to finish


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## TheRustedKnife

Metal for outsides, vinyl for off angle insides. I find the roller really makes a difference with the no-coat. Just can't seem to get enough pressure for the Ultrflex-450, which is a really nice product for certain applications.


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## mudslingr

I love coating vinyl bead but putting it on is laborious. Minimum 3 coats to get a good finish in my opinion. Glue and staple.
Otherwise it's paper bead for me everywhere except off angles which will get the Ultraflex. Occasionally I use some Ultraflex on a 90° angle that has a nasty gap that regular tape won't fill.
Ultraflex is also great for those outside basement walls that have 30ft long or longer ledges rather than 3 or 4 pieces of bead.


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## TheRustedKnife

mudslingr said:


> Ultraflex is also great for those outside basement walls that have 30ft long or longer ledges rather than 3 or 4 pieces of bead.


Yes, like long soffits and such.


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## carpentaper

mudslingr said:


> Otherwise it's paper bead for me everywhere except off angles which will get the Ultraflex. Occasionally I use some Ultraflex on a 90° angle that has a nasty gap that regular tape won't fill.
> Ultraflex is also great for those outside basement walls that have 30ft long or longer ledges rather than 3 or 4 pieces of bead.


good idea.


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## RocknRoller

For my crew, Vinyl beads and reveals are our choice. Once you get past the few differences on the install you can enjoy the durability. Always pissed me off when my guys would wreck metal beads loading & unloading and stepping on.
Plastic beads from home depo are crooked and don't lay flat..what we buy from drywall supply are ten times better....my 2 cents


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## Mountain Man

Here in colorado almost everything goes bullnose and we use regular old metal bead. Two nails in the bottem, two in the middle and two in the top and then we staple it the rest of the way on. All cuts made by hand, no need for a little miter pattern. I hate using paper face or plastic bullnose except arch flex for arched corners. And to do those I put on regular metal bullnose legs then cut the arch flex to size, glue it on to arch and then staple it. First coat with plus three and then when cleaning off the bullnose I only clean the center of the bullnose leaving a solid line of mud on both edges. After the first coat dries I take the trim tex arch tool and fully cost over the bullnose with hot mud. Make sure I have a clean corner and as soon as it sets up I'm ready for my second coat. Take care to clean only the center of the bullnose and not gouge the hot mud cleaning the bullnose. When the second coat is dry coat the bullnose with plus three with the trim tex arch tool. Use a detail sanding block when dry and touch up if necessary. Hope that's helpful!


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## Square Foot

Mountain Man said:


> Here in colorado almost everything goes bullnose and we use regular old metal bead. Two nails in the bottem, two in the middle and two in the top and then we staple it the rest of the way on. All cuts made by hand, no need for a little miter pattern. I hate using paper face or plastic bullnose except arch flex for arched corners. And to do those I put on regular metal bullnose legs then cut the arch flex to size, glue it on to arch and then staple it. First coat with plus three and then when cleaning off the bullnose I only clean the center of the bullnose leaving a solid line of mud on both edges. After the first coat dries I take the trim tex arch tool and fully cost over the bullnose with hot mud. Make sure I have a clean corner and as soon as it sets up I'm ready for my second coat. Take care to clean only the center of the bullnose and not gouge the hot mud cleaning the bullnose. When the second coat is dry coat the bullnose with plus three with the trim tex arch tool. Use a detail sanding block when dry and touch up if necessary. Hope that's helpful!


When it come to bullnose, I'll take the No-Coat bead every time.


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## 2buckcanuck

Square Foot said:


> When it come to bullnose, I'll take the No-Coat bead every time.


Hold on, I just thanked you for your post









You mean trim-tex vinyl bullnose,,,, right.... not no coat,,,,,,:blink:


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## Square Foot

2buckcanuck said:


> Hold on, I just thanked you for your post
> 
> You mean trim-tex vinyl bullnose,,,, right.... not no coat,,,,,,:blink:


When it comes to straight runs, I prefer the No-coat bullnose. Have not tried their product for arches...I use the vinyl for that.

If you would like to retract your thanks, I will understand


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## sdrdrywall

I've got to where i only use no coat bead. Its easy to put On and best to box.and there sticks. can be used for off angles. Real nice easy to fill.not really any more expensive than superwide


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## 2buckcanuck

Square Foot said:


> When it comes to straight runs, I prefer the No-coat bullnose. Have not tried their product for arches...I use the vinyl for that.
> 
> If you would like to retract your thanks, I will understand


Live and learn:blink::blink: http://www.no-coat.com/.docs/_sid/1e6a84105b9cc2303132ac8c127d0274/pg/10135

In my defense, we only get the no-coat in the rolls, here in Banada

The pre-cut ninety is too much money also:yes:

So thank you:jester:


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## sdrdrywall

There archbead is awesome easier to put On than plastic mud it up and roll no staples no glue


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## Square Foot

2buckcanuck said:


> Live and learn:blink::blink: http://www.no-coat.com/.docs/_sid/1e6a84105b9cc2303132ac8c127d0274/pg/10135
> 
> In my defense, we only get the no-coat in the rolls, here in Banada
> 
> The pre-cut ninety is too much money also:yes:
> 
> So thank you:jester:


I didn't even consider that it might not be available to you. Just thought that Trim-Tex was your preference.


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## Square Foot

sdrdrywall said:


> There archbead is awesome easier to put On than plastic mud it up and roll no staples no glue


I'll have to order some.


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## sdrdrywall

Its available in 90 and bullnose


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## CatD7

Vinyl in bathrooms.

Sheetrock brand paper faced metal beads everywhere else, run through the green hopper, of course.

Have a good time all the time, and dream while you're sleeping.


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## Whosnxt1776

Dads been using paper 15 years. 10 I have been there. He said there was a lot of warranty call backs with the metal bead cracking. We havent had one paper bead crack. We used to use straight flex but when no coat and level line were available we switched and never looked back! Only plastic bead we use is for arches and now bull nose. We used to use paper bull nose but the GC who wants bull nose cut the board price so we told him we were switching to cheaper material, youll get what you pay for.


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## bmitch

sdrdrywall said:


> There archbead is awesome easier to put On than plastic mud it up and roll no staples no glue


 there could be a real advantage to applying the no coat arch.i,ve always had to be very carefull sanding the plastic bull.even when the arch is clean, ready for a light sand ,just one stroke across the surface and you,re removing mud out the slots.would it sand out better using the papered surface?


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## Mountain Man

b said:


> there could be a real advantage to applying the no coat arch.i,ve always had to be very carefull sanding the plastic bull.even when the arch is clean, ready for a light sand ,just one stroke across the surface and you,re removing mud out the slots.would it sand out better using the papered surface?


That's why I use the bullnose tool and completely coat the arch flex with hot mud first coat and then with regular mud second coat. Light sand with a flexible detail sponge and it comes out sweet, no slots. Materials are very limited in what we can get in this area, so we gotta use what we got at hand.


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## Square Foot

Mountain Man said:


> That's why I use the bullnose tool and completely coat the arch flex with hot mud first coat and then with regular mud second coat. Light sand with a flexible detail sponge and it comes out sweet, no slots. Materials are very limited in what we can get in this area, so we gotta use what we got at hand.


I use this tool as well and as you said, completely cover the plastic.


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## Philma Crevices

I too cheap for your fancy smancy bull nose coating tools. I just use a scrap peice of bead facorty end :thumbsup:


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## chris

I will convince most customers/builders to go with the mini bull on arches. There are no slots to fill on the mini. In fact its been quite a while since Ive had to coat an arch. We still will use metal on majority of our jobs just cause thats the way I was taught and am pretty fast with it.In a perfect world with no window returns or closet wraps or kerf doorways, zip-strip etc. etc. I would prefer no coat sticks ( stand-ups) but I prefer metal for windows and kerf doors. I can do a 3 or 4 way wrap darn near perfect with metal:thumbsup: where the other ways Im not as good


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## sdrdrywall

b said:


> there could be a real advantage to applying the no coat arch.i,ve always had to be very carefull sanding the plastic bull.even when the arch is clean, ready for a light sand ,just one stroke across the surface and you,re removing mud out the slots.would it sand out better using the papered surface?


It defiantly sands easier than plastic. I've always had the same problem sand too much and you start seeing cracks and tabs


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## bmitch

thats what i wanted to hear sdrdrywall.i was.nt aware that no coat manuf. an archway bull until you posted it.thanks.i should'nt have any problem ordering some in.


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## Trim-Tex

How does everyone feel now 2013 ???


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## desertmud

Just finished a remodel job retexturing walls. All bullnose metal bead. Homeowner went through and marked all the small dents in bullnose corners after we had painted. I think the Trimtex mudset beads will be a blessing when it comes to callbacks. They do not have the shiny coating like other vynal beads, making the mud stick better to it. Ttex mudset beads are very solid and can take a beating.
For now they have me sold.


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## Toontowntaper

Trim tex has it's place ... And that should be in every house. The time trim tex saves on call backs if any makes up for the so called extra time installing it. I won't use anything but trim tex


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## silverstilts

desertmud said:


> Just finished a remodel job retexturing walls. All bullnose metal bead. Homeowner went through and marked all the small dents in bullnose corners after we had painted. I think the Trimtex mudset beads will be a blessing when it comes to callbacks. They do not have the shiny coating like other vynal beads, making the mud stick better to it. Ttex mudset beads are very solid and can take a beating.
> For now they have me sold.


 So why all the small dents?


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## bmitch

Toontowntaper said:


> Trim tex has it's place ... And that should be in every house. The time trim tex saves on call backs if any makes up for the so called extra time installing it. I won't use anything but trim tex


I,m relieved that my 37 yrs. in this business have allowed me to make decisions that allow me to use all the products available to me.i use all of them,and they all have their place..i,m pretty confident i'm not as close minded as you are.


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## icerock drywall

silverstilts said:


> So why all the small dents?


I thought I was doing a good job selling steel corners on my jobs and saying paper is crap...there both crap  after using trim tex
I went back to an old job and looked around becouse the hanger did a very bad job!!! but the owners were the hangers LOL and then I saw my steel bull nose with 3 small dents  he did not say anything but I did not like it...I will never use steel on any more jobs:whistling2:


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## bmitch

I have to admit ice.when I said I use all the products available to me,i was wrong .i'm not familiar with these beads. I,m not sure that I could find a place for these.


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## Mr.Brightstar

icerock drywall said:


> I thought I was doing a good job selling steel corners on my jobs and saying paper is crap...there both crap  after using trim tex
> I went back to an old job and looked around becouse the hanger did a very bad job!!! but the owners were the hangers LOL and then I saw my steel bull nose with 3 small dents  he did not say anything but I did not like it...I will never use steel on any more jobs:whistling2:


That looks like veneer bead for blue board.


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## silverstilts

Mr.Brightstar said:


> That looks like veneer bead for blue board.


 Thats what it is. It is something plasters use. Back to paperface I prefer it. I just don't quite really know how I feel about the vinyl . I often think how so much crap is made out of plastic these days not holding up. Sure go ahead and beat on it all you want, what happens after a few years does it get old and brittle? Ever leave vinyl for a while and go to use it it is all brittle? What then? I know what most are thinking the certain way it is made it will never get brittle. We will see how great that bead is in another 20 yrs and see how it is holding up eh?


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## desertmud

silverstilts said:


> So why all the small dents?


Metal bullnose corner bead was the original. House was about 15 years old. Dents are very common in metal bullnose where someone knocks a piece of furniture into it or kids with their toys.
As far as how vinyl will hold up in twenty years, that's a good question. Plastics usually become brittle when exposed to the elements sun/moisture. I wonder if once covered in mud and paint, it becomes incapsulated and protected? Maybe Joe can can explain his theory behind it.


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## Toontowntaper

b said:


> I,m relieved that my 37 yrs. in this business have allowed me to make decisions that allow me to use all the products available to me.i use all of them,and they all have their place..i,m pretty confident i'm not as close minded as you are.


Easy there b Mitch I wasn't saying I don't use every product suited for the situation at hand. But for corners I will use trim tex instead of metal paper metal. The fact that there were dents in the corners is what I was referring to not using metal because of the time needed to fix that. Why not install trim tex which can withstand a far more beating them metal


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## moore

I Finished up a little cape cod this morning ..The builder was walking out the door with my bill in hand He said I'll put the check on your dash ..

I was loading up tools when I swung my split plank around and hit the bulk head above the front steps ..Paper face bead.. RIGHT THERE AT THE FRONT DOOR!!!:furious: A big ole dent!!! I started stomping around like Yosemite Sam ..Frekkin frankkin flippin [email protected]@. Then It was off to the truck for a bag of 5min and a hack saw


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## Kiwiman

I know the feeling well :glare:


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## chris

moore said:


> I Finished up a little cape cod this morning ..The builder was walking out the door with my bill in hand He said I'll put the check on your dash ..
> 
> I was loading up tools when I swung my split plank around and hit the bulk head above the front steps ..Paper face bead.. RIGHT THERE AT THE FRONT DOOR!!!:furious: A big ole dent!!! I started stomping around like Yosemite Sam ..Frekkin frankkin flippin [email protected]@. Then It was off to the truck for a bag of 5min and a hack saw


 Something tells me you wont be the only one to dent that stick


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## bmitch

I owe you an apology toontown,i was sorry for writing it 2 minutes after I sent it.i know this is going to sound sarcastic but its not directed at you or anyone else,where does all this plastic products end in home constr.some custom plastic casing ,some custom plastic baseboard,how about some elegant plastic lighting fixtures,vinyl used on my jobs will be very limited.


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## Toontowntaper

No hard feelings B Mitch.


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## Trim-Tex

desertmud said:


> Metal bullnose corner bead was the original. House was about 15 years old. Dents are very common in metal bullnose where someone knocks a piece of furniture into it or kids with their toys.
> As far as how vinyl will hold up in twenty years, that's a good question. Plastics usually become brittle when exposed to the elements sun/moisture. I wonder if once covered in mud and paint, it becomes incapsulated and protected? Maybe Joe can can explain his theory behind it.


Under a layer of paint, in a wall or buried underground PVC (Poly Vinyl Chloride) will perform and last 700 + years! The only enemy of PVC is the harsh sun and UV rays that are emitted, slight yellowing and embrittlement will form over years of exposure to UV. Mostly in climates nearer the equator. 40 years ago UV was an issue only when exposed, but for over 3decades it's a non issue due to the continuous advancement of UV inhibitors that are blended in. 

PVC is impervious to moisture and largely resistant to chemicals, weather and abrasion. Moreover,
the chlorine content makes the material highly flame retardant. In fact, PVC has a high flash point of 900°F and does not readily ignite. It is therefore categorized as being "self-extinguishing". 
It is normal for materials to expand and contract during temperature changes. As with most plastics, vinyl will become less flexible in colder weather conditions. However, unless subjected to unusual impact, it will not break. If rigid PVC is exposed to temperatures over 140°F, it could deform. A light colored acrylic latex paint can help prevent PVC from deforming if it is exposed to direct sunlight. The use of oil based paints is not recommended. UV radiation will not penetrate even thin layers of paint coatings or drywall mud. 

For more information on PVC used in building products, see video below.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=IxBGrbR5OHQ


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## RocknRoller

Durable vinyl for my jobs and crew

Set it and forget it !


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## 2buckcanuck

Lets see if you guys can guess who this DWT member is.......
(photo has been edited to protect DWT member on the right, from that evil photo shopping, sheep shagging member called "Kiwiman":furious.

Now this DWT member can go to his grave proclaiming he is the luckiest man in the world, because he got to see and visit Glencoe Ontario........... If only the rest of you could be that lucky

Had a cool day, and got to pick his brain, it was like meeting a Movie star


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## moore

Your thinning down 2buck. Not having jr around is putting you on the run eh?


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## 2buckcanuck

moore said:


> Your thinning down 2buck. Not having jr around is putting you on the run eh?


Well, not to go off subject.......:whistling2:

I thought I was losing weight with 2bjr gone, until I weighed myself one night.

Odd thing was, next day I was doing a house for a builder that lost 100 pds, and we got talking. He said that sentence I hate to hear "Life style changes", but he got me reading labels on the food you buy. Stopped eating out and began brown bagging it. Changed what I take in my coffee now(no more double double







). And eating fruit at night if you had to junk out. All was good for a while, I was losing 2 pds per week. But after losing 14 pds, I have held the same for the pass month

I was thin like you Moore(except taller:whistling2 when I started this trade, the weight can sneak up on you fast. Hoping if I lose more weight, I can install the Trim-tex bead on faster..........

There, that last statement puts this thread back on track


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## moore

Check this out Joe ...My bros from magic city drywall do some really nice lines... https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=763398810352542&set=vb.243686822323746&type=2&theater I am impressed every time I see there work!


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## Kiwiman

2buckcanuck said:


> Lets see if you guys can guess who this DWT member is.......
> (photo has been edited to protect DWT member on the right, from that evil photo shopping, sheep shagging member called "Kiwiman":furious.


I managed to edit your feeble attempt at disguising your face :shifty:
I erased the first layer to reveal what I thought was your true identity, then I erased a little further and discovered a 2nd image hidden under the first ugly layer.....will the real 2buck please stand up :glare:


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## 2buckcanuck

Kiwiman said:


> I managed to edit your feeble attempt at disguising your face
> I erased the first layer to reveal what I thought was your true identity, then I erased a little further and discovered a 2nd image hidden under the first ugly layer.....will the real 2buck please stand up :glare:


You kiwi's know about our crack smoking mayor of Toronto Rob Ford
Alright,,, your on to us then Kiwiman:furious:

Joe wanted to know if we had any crack houses in Glencoe, like they do in Toronto. And I said "Sure, come on down !!!"

So we got into a drunken stupor, smoked a lot of crack and got our picture taken just like Rob Ford. But unlike Mayor Rob Ford, we came up with a great new slogan for all the tapers of the world.

SMOKE CRACK, THEN FILL CRACK 

And we don't mean the crack that you sheep shagging Kiwi's like to fill Kiwiman:furious:

:jester:


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## moore

Joe!!!! You should have known better!! :jester: LOL!


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## JustMe

.....


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## Trim-Tex

:blink: I"m speechless on this one.



Back on topic, Every day we are earning respect and business with our Mud Set Beads so thank you all for the opportunities. 

Joe


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