# Ridge in centre of tape



## Ezock (Jul 4, 2012)

Can anybody explain why I get the odd ridge in the centre of my tape as it is drying. Its annoying due to the little bump it creates<img smilieid="24" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.drywalltalk.com/images/smilies/blink.gif" border="0"> which makes me feather the joint out further to get rid of it. It only seems to happen on the odd bevel joint.<br>


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Ezock said:


> Can anybody explain why I get the odd ridge in the centre of my tape as it is drying. Its annoying due to the little bump it creates<img smilieid="24" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.drywalltalk.com/images/smilies/blink.gif" border="0"> which makes me feather the joint out further to get rid of it. It only seems to happen on the odd bevel joint.<br>


Would the drywall your coating over be certainteed drywall

need to know what method your applying tape, zook, by hand, banjo, slop bucket etc.......:yes:


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## PrecisionTaping (Feb 2, 2012)

On the odd bevel joint eh? Hmm...
well, more info like 2buck mentioned is needed.
Is there a slight gap in your bevel's between sheets?


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

PrecisionTaping said:


> On the odd bevel joint eh? Hmm...
> well, more info like 2buck mentioned is needed.
> Is there a slight gap in your bevel's between sheets?


And well we wait for his response, we can listen to the song where he lives........ Ouch, my back still hurts when I hear that word:whistling2:


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## Ezock (Jul 4, 2012)

The drywall is certainteed , and no gap between . I always use setting mud to prefill. I apply tape either by hand or use mud tube with flat applicator.


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## P.A. ROCKER (Jul 15, 2011)

Didn't you mud the top of the tape when you were wiping?


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## Ezock (Jul 4, 2012)

If you mean put a thin layer over the tape not typically, not till I do my fill coat. I have not had these issues until a couple months ago and the drywall has been changing around here so not sure if that has something to do with it. 2buck you asked if it was certainteed, is that good or bad?


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

I'll step out of line and answer for 2Buck. Yep, that's bad. Certainteed is having some horrible issues with their rock. And that is putting it mildly!


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

Ezock said:


> Can anybody explain why I get the odd ridge in the centre of my tape as it is drying. Its annoying due to the little bump it creates<img smilieid="24" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.drywalltalk.com/images/smilies/blink.gif" border="0"> which makes me feather the joint out further to get rid of it. It only seems to happen on the odd bevel joint.<br>


you tape your seams and butts with hot mud ? 
Keep your taping mud thin..When it thickins up...thin it down..
The thicker your hot mud is while taping seams ..the more it will push the crease out...Walk through a room after tapes on ..If it looks like the crease is gonna peak..push it in with a run of your thumb...hot mud swells..a/p shrinks

I have been taping my butts and seams with hotmud for the last 15 years .due to high humidity and no heat on the job in the winters ..hot mud seems to be the only mud that will hold up on the tape coat....






I caulk my angles with tooth paste....:yes:


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## PrecisionTaping (Feb 2, 2012)

Ezock said:


> If you mean put a thin layer over the tape not typically, not till I do my fill coat. I have not had these issues until a couple months ago and the drywall has been changing around here so not sure if that has something to do with it. 2buck you asked if it was certainteed, is that good or bad?


http://www.drywalltalk.com/f9/certainteed-drywall-problems-3220/

http://www.drywalltalk.com/f9/certainteed-wallboard-2685/









Tim0282 said:


> I'll step out of line and answer for 2Buck. Yep, that's bad. Certainteed is having some horrible issues with their rock. And that is putting it mildly!


That was putting it very mildly.
Ezock, let's put it this way...
I'm pretty sure Moore, took a crap and wiped his ass with a certainteed t-shirt...
As for your tape peaking, Moore's right. If you're taping with hotmud that might be the problem. Usually you'd see it peaking after 10-15 minutes of the tape being up. And like Moore said, just run your finger along it pushing it into the bevel a bit. That way it will dry inwards.


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## Ezock (Jul 4, 2012)

I usually use the cgc machine mud for most of my stages. I try to stay away from hotmud as much as I can so do not easily tape with it unless really small job. So that bump it shows on the video I am very familiar with. Which drywall do you guys recommend? 
Also I am assuming that tucking in that ridge line with finger should also work with regular mud then as well.....and I do keep it quite thin.

So now that I have read through 13 pages of certainteed bashing and the t shirts they give away, I am definitely up for reform in the drywall production industry. In the meantime who to use because for me even Lafarge has left me dissapponted. notice ceilings sag with their ceiling board


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## PrecisionTaping (Feb 2, 2012)

Ezock said:


> I usually use the cgc machine mud for most of my stages. I try to stay away from hotmud as much as I can so do not easily tape with it unless really small job. So that bump it shows on the video I am very familiar with. Which drywall do you guys recommend?
> Also I am assuming that tucking in that ridge line with finger should also work with regular mud then as well.....and I do keep it quite thin.
> 
> So now that I have read through 13 pages of certainteed bashing and the t shirts they give away, I am definitely up for reform in the drywall production industry. In the meantime who to use because for me even Lafarge has left me dissapponted. notice ceilings sag with their ceiling board


I've never used lafarge, I've heard good things about them around my parts though. There's only the one supplier that carries them however.

I just stick with CGC if I can.
Although something funny did happen this week.
A new contractor I've just started working for, I've known him a while just never had the opportunity to work for him and finally he called me up. So anyways, I told him to order CGC, and to make sure there was no Certainteed.
Anyways, he got mostly CGC but for some reason all the 8' sheets were a company called "Cabbot", which I have never heard of.

So I showed up and I was like "What's this crap?" And he was like "Isn't that what you wanted? CGC?" and I was like "Umm...that says Cabbot on it...not cgc"
Then the contractor looked at it closer and was like "oh,ummm....Cabbot....Gypsum..Company?....CGC!!"
I just laughed! "ya, sure...good enough....it's CGC :whistling2:"
As long as it's not certainteed!

oh! And 2buck...look at that :whistling2: Another taper who uses Machine Mud :yes: :thumbsup:
We're spreading!


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

PrecisionTaping said:


> oh! And 2buck...look at that :whistling2: Another taper who uses Machine Mud :yes: :thumbsup:
> We're spreading!


yes, and guess what the supply house sent us the other day, machine mud. Even mixed it half and half with the red, to do the angles. And guess what was wet today........ There goes my weekend off:furious::furious:


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## PrecisionTaping (Feb 2, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> yes, and guess what the supply house sent us the other day, machine mud. Even mixed it half and half with the red, to do the angles. And guess what was wet today........ There goes my weekend off:furious::furious:


Really!? That's so weird...it must be different batches or something...
I did a knockdown this morning, not a huge room. It was like 40 sheets. Half a basement. Anyways, I did my knockdown, afterwards I did my first coat of paint everywhere which only maybe took an hour, the home owners were chatting me up,(never got so much praise in my life, just for one stupid little basement! lol!) and then I cleaned up all my tools and loaded up my truck and by the I left, my design ceiling was almost completely dry. And that's a knockdown! I do mine pretty thick too...
I mean, it was a blistering hot day..and there was allot of circulation, so that helped allot. But still, point is, mine doesn't seem to take as long to dry as yours...I don't get it..


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

Try doing a pre-fill and see if you still have the problem. Like this. Post# 13

http://www.drywalltalk.com/f2/something-died-inside-me-weekend-3267/


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

gazman said:


> Try doing a pre-fill and see if you still have the problem. Like this. Post# 13
> 
> http://www.drywalltalk.com/f2/something-died-inside-me-weekend-3267/


back drinking again gazzy:whistling2:

I do pre-fill, were talking angles here, and PT's crappy mud he likes

We had 2nd coat beads dry in the basement, But a 12,000 sq ft house with angles done, glazed/flushed (3 stories) were wet.

Machine mud:furious:


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

This time I think you are the one that has been drinking.
I was trying to help the guy out with his original question. And get back on topic:whistling2:.


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

gazman said:


> This time I think you are the one that has been drinking.
> I was trying to help the guy out with his original question. And get back on topic:whistling2:.


:whistling2::whistling2::whistling2:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Hey PT, I figured out what ezock's problem is:thumbup:

He's using machine mud:yes:


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## PrecisionTaping (Feb 2, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> Hey PT, I figured out what ezock's problem is:thumbup:
> 
> He's using machine mud:yes:


Quit trying to stir sh!t up! 
Oh hey! I had the breakfast sandwich on a Maple Cinnamon french toast bagel from timmies 
You were right....sooo good!!
Didn't even know they existed! :thumbsup:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

PrecisionTaping said:


> Quit trying to stir sh!t up!
> Oh hey! I had the breakfast sandwich on a Maple Cinnamon french toast bagel from timmies
> You were right....sooo good!!
> Didn't even know they existed! :thumbsup:


Figures :furious:,,, I got there today and they ran out:furious:


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## PrecisionTaping (Feb 2, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> Figures :furious:,,, I got there today and they ran out:furious:


Well how's that my fault!?
I seriously doubt they got a phone call "Hey! Some idiot in Sudbury just figured out this sh!t tastes delicious! Head office called and they want us to ship all our remaining bagels there"

Probably not....:jester:


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## DLSdrywall (May 22, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> yes, and guess what the supply house sent us the other day, machine mud. Even mixed it half and half with the red, to do the angles. And guess what was wet today........ There goes my weekend off:furious::furious:


I'm using machine mud this week i loaded the basement of the building i'm doing been wet for 3 days. SInce i was paid by the hour thought i'd milk some hours helping the guys board. So refreshing putting on the tools slapping up some board...getting away from the mud. I'm at the point where taping bores me i need a challenge.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

DLSdrywall said:


> I'm using machine mud this week i loaded the basement of the building i'm doing been wet for 3 days. SInce i was paid by the hour thought i'd milk some hours helping the guys board. So refreshing putting on the tools slapping up some board...getting away from the mud. I'm at the point where taping bores me i need a challenge.


 I LOVE hanging!!!


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## Mudstar (Feb 15, 2008)

Ezock said:


> Can anybody explain why I get the odd ridge in the centre of my tape as it is drying. Its annoying due to the little bump it creates<img smilieid="24" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.drywalltalk.com/images/smilies/blink.gif" border="0"> which makes me feather the joint out further to get rid of it. It only seems to happen on the odd bevel joint.<br>


Its the way your wiping your tape. 

I could explain but its a answer for the tricks of the trade thread...............

:thumbsup:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Try using the front of your knife. Yes there is a front and a back.
Really, that isn't the problem with the ridge. Sorry, it is late and I was feeling mean!:yawn: I'm going to be doing this tomorrow if I don't get out of here!


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

I still say a full prefill will stop it from happening. On my last job I did a total pre-fill of all the ceilings, and only pre-filled the gaps that I could see on the walls. The ceilings tapes went in as flat as a night carters hat. And they walls exactly as described a few ridges down the center.:yes:


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

We have been doing a complete prefill on all ceiling joints for quite a while now (Thanks 2Buck). On the job that we just finished we missed a prefill on one joint. And this is what happened.
All the rest were nice and flat.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

I fight that all the time ...Pre filling all the seams in a home is way too much time for me to spend [$] I just run my finger down the crease right before the hot mud sets. 
After vng the butts and pre filled them I've wasted enough time on fixing a problem the wallboard co. left for the next guy


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## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

It Sucks eh.:furious:


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## Kiwiman (Jun 14, 2008)

I don't miss those days.
Come over to the other side, the no pre-filling Fibafuse side :yes:


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

This happens ever so slightly on our houses at times except the line is sunk in not outward. I thought it had something to do with not enough mud being put on the tapes with the banjo but that was not the case. Also thought it could be the mud shrinking a lot but our mud doesn't shrink hardly at all. Still haven't really pinned it down. I know on the final coat our finishers will box the joints pretty tight like normal then go back and streak the middle when running the screws. This has even happened after the house was pointed up with a light where we saw nothing, but a couple months later the little sunk in line was there. I'm still trying to figure out the root cause of it.


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

Kiwiman said:


> I don't miss those days.
> Come over to the other side, the no pre-filling Fibafuse side :yes:


I want to use it in our houses really bad but my dad won't stock it as it is too expensive. $5.80 a roll compared to $1.75 for paper tape. I know that it isn't that much more if you only use it for the flats but every little bit helps.


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## TDI Scott (Feb 26, 2011)

I agree with mudstar. It is the way you are wiping your tape. Lay your knife down a little more as you wipe. Have you ever noticed it happens more on small headers or tabs next to doors that you can't lay your knife down on? Same thing on long seams if your knife is on the wrong angle.


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## bmitch (Dec 10, 2011)

just a comment,i run a zook full out i wipe it right away,if i run two tubes out then go back to wipe i,ll get the same results as gazmans photo.i wipe out tight and backfill over the tape and have good results.no prefill unless it's over certainteed sh;t .


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## sdrdrywall (Sep 4, 2010)

I get that if were pushing a job and tape and coat same day


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

thefinisher said:


> This happens ever so slightly on our houses at times except the line is sunk in not outward. I thought it had something to do with not enough mud being put on the tapes with the banjo but that was not the case. Also thought it could be the mud shrinking a lot but our mud doesn't shrink hardly at all. Still haven't really pinned it down. I know on the final coat our finishers will box the joints pretty tight like normal then go back and streak the middle when running the screws. This has even happened after the house was pointed up with a light where we saw nothing, but a couple months later the little sunk in line was there. I'm still trying to figure out the root cause of it.


The tape coat needs to completly dry/cure before block coat..
The block coat needs to completly dry /cure before the skim.. Sounds like your boys are pushing it.After paint your muds still drying.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

gazman said:


> It Sucks eh.:furious:


 Sometimes I give it too much finger..


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

TDI Scott said:


> I agree with mudstar. It is the way you are wiping your tape. Lay your knife down a little more as you wipe. Have you ever noticed it happens more on small headers or tabs next to doors that you can't lay your knife down on? Same thing on long seams if your knife is on the wrong angle.


 Depends on the board too..


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## Ezock (Jul 4, 2012)

I started prefilling ALL my joints and have not noticed it happening anymore. As for the angled knife I will definitely keep an eye out and see if I find a difference. Any of you guys ever tape a home where they spray foamed the attic directly to the drywall, then layer of cellulose over top? I recently finished a home, no issues, 4 days later they call and say we have a problem......joint was sucking in on ALL joints on the ceiling (gaps were prefilled). Some spots even dryed out so much it cracked. . Sooo.... I removed all tape from ceiling, scratched out mud(no fun) even took a chisel and removed mud from groove, prefilled everything with setting mud, then continue finish. Now happening again Fortunately h/o very good to work for


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Kiwiman said:


> I don't miss those days.
> Come over to the other side, the no pre-filling Fibafuse side


I don't know:whistling2:
First time using the fuse, we pre-filled some joints, and some we didn't, it was a garage, so it was a good place to experiment. We used a half and half mix of HM & AP. There was a huge difference.

But, you kiwi's have those sexxy hotmuds, so guessing if you taped with Hotmud, it would turn out good(which is why Moore should check out the fuse)



thefinisher said:


> This happens ever so slightly on our houses at times except the line is sunk in not outward. I thought it had something to do with not enough mud being put on the tapes with the banjo but that was not the case. Also thought it could be the mud shrinking a lot but our mud doesn't shrink hardly at all. Still haven't really pinned it down. I know on the final coat our finishers will box the joints pretty tight like normal then go back and streak the middle when running the screws. This has even happened after the house was pointed up with a light where we saw nothing, but a couple months later the little sunk in line was there. I'm still trying to figure out the root cause of it.


Moore is right in his post, but there are some other variables.
CD board (1/2" ceiling drywall) has a rounder edge/lip to it, well 1/2" regular wall drywall is more square. Or CD board is more like this...)(... well regular wall board, the bevel is more like this ...][....
So the CD board can take longer to dry, and tends to crinkle more when wiping. I know you half to slave drive your Mexicans, but a pre-fill makes a huge difference, in dry time and point ups/touch ups down the road. You can pre-fill by hand, a compound tube or mud runner with a flat applicator, and I hear some use a nail spotter.

Another issue is (more of a problem here in Banada) the drywall is cold, and the air temperature is warm. You start a house on a cold day, and they turn the heat on the day you show up(for example). This will do strange things to the tape also, as the walls warm up.



TDI Scott said:


> I agree with mudstar. It is the way you are wiping your tape. Lay your knife down a little more as you wipe. Have you ever noticed it happens more on small headers or tabs next to doors that you can't lay your knife down on? Same thing on long seams if your knife is on the wrong angle.


Hate to say it, but Mudstar is right, the flatter you hold the knife, the less it will crinkle.



Ezock said:


> I started prefilling ALL my joints and have not noticed it happening anymore. As for the angled knife I will definitely keep an eye out and see if I find a difference. Any of you guys ever tape a home where they spray foamed the attic directly to the drywall, then layer of cellulose over top? I recently finished a home, no issues, 4 days later they call and say we have a problem......joint was sucking in on ALL joints on the ceiling (gaps were prefilled). Some spots even dryed out so much it cracked. . Sooo.... I removed all tape from ceiling, scratched out mud(no fun) even took a chisel and removed mud from groove, prefilled everything with setting mud, then continue finish. Now happening again Fortunately h/o very good to work for


I don't know:blink:
But to start with, it's impossible for mud to "dry out to much", dry is dry. Also sounds like someone is blaming the wrong person.

To start, was it open or closed cell spray foam? Open cell holds a lot of moister, and they recommend a vapour barrier. closed cell dose not need a poly barrier. yet, they put cellulose (blown in) insulation on top. Just a guess, sounds like the drywall absorbed the moister of the spray foam. Meaning the drywall it self finally dried, which affected your joints.

Hope your not fixing for free, I think you should be researching into things a bit more. Unless your lucky, and you can find someone on here really smart


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## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

Gaz is right, Prefill makes a huge difference, Super flat paper tapes. Fuse is great as well, I did a bathroom a few weeks ago, Used up some paper tape and holy hell did it ridge up :blink: Worst ever, Dont know why or what was different?? Tight sheets of board, I didnt coat over it, Yes i put the tape centre crease down, Wow it stuck out, Yes i tryed moores finger trick, Seemed to make it worse. Fuse wont carry on like that.


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

moore said:


> The tape coat needs to completly dry/cure before block coat..
> The block coat needs to completly dry /cure before the skim.. Sounds like your boys are pushing it.After paint your muds still drying.


I know that will do it, but the tape is completely dry when they bed/block... I know we used to have some finishers who would really rush things and the tapes would do that even more so. Heck our guys will prefill things with durabond if it is bad enough to need it. Shouldn't need to prefill anything if the board is hung well. I mean it is sunk in just a hair really and only sometimes and only on ceilings. Only time we will tape and bed with wet tape is when we are using durabond, but I don't really like that either.


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## Ezock (Jul 4, 2012)

I believe they said it was closed cell


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## getplastered (Jan 3, 2012)

I've seen this a lot lately too...don't remember it being a problem in the past.
How the hell can you prefill before tape...I don't prefill and there are spots where tape shows through after my first box coat...wouldn't prefill make it even worse?

We're doing a house right now that was rained on for two months before it was closed in 2 weeks ago...boarders hung it withought heat a week ago...we started taping 5 days ago and introduced heat...I can just imagine what kinda mess this will develop into...not to mention there's no insulation in the attic...it's been below zero during the day for a week...


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## Ezock (Jul 4, 2012)

I was concerned about the tape not being covered properly at first as well, but by far the majority has been hiding well while remaining flat... my other biggest culprit is the high shoulders. I just finished taping another house today and seeing the difference definitely seems worth while (but I did have a difficult time trying to get myself to just do it at first).


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## Ezock (Jul 4, 2012)

I have also been using the CGC brand for a bit now, not sure if that makes a difference for you


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## jcampbell (Aug 26, 2012)

getplastered said:


> I've seen this a lot lately too...don't remember it being a problem in the past.
> How the hell can you prefill before tape...I don't prefill and there are spots where tape shows through after my first box coat...wouldn't prefill make it even worse?
> 
> We're doing a house right now that was rained on for two months before it was closed in 2 weeks ago...boarders hung it withought heat a week ago...we started taping 5 days ago and introduced heat...I can just imagine what kinda mess this will develop into...not to mention there's no insulation in the attic...it's been below zero during the day for a week...


I know where this one is going.......doesn't look good. Hope you didn't warrantee the work!


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

getplastered said:


> I've seen this a lot lately too...don't remember it being a problem in the past.
> How the hell can you prefill before tape...I don't prefill and there are spots where tape shows through after my first box coat...wouldn't prefill make it even worse?
> 
> We're doing a house right now that was rained on for two months before it was closed in 2 weeks ago...boarders hung it withought heat a week ago...we started taping 5 days ago and introduced heat...I can just imagine what kinda mess this will develop into...not to mention there's no insulation in the attic...it's been below zero during the day for a week...


My world!!:thumbup: Not cold here like you guys by no means ,,but the speck i'm on now has no power It was in the upper 60s earlier this week but today In the 40s ..Tonight down to the 30s...If I had power I could run the dehumidifier at night [ the dehumidifier helps a ton..don't let anyone tell ya different] These jobs are the very reason why I tape my butts and seams with hot mud..I have this spec taped and blocked ..will let it set over the weekend so to start another job ..If it's dry enough or not Monday ..It's getting skimmed out!!! When I turn My bill in on these jobs I put in LARGE print at the very bottom..NO GUARANTEES DUE TO INSUFFICIENT HEATING.
If he has problem with that ..I throw a empty bucket in the back of his truck ,and tell him to go home and read that mother ****er!!!!!


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

getplastered said:


> I've seen this a lot lately too...don't remember it being a problem in the past.
> How the hell can you prefill before tape...I don't prefill and there are spots where tape shows through after my first box coat...wouldn't prefill make it even worse?
> 
> We're doing a house right now that was rained on for two months before it was closed in 2 weeks ago...boarders hung it withought heat a week ago...we started taping 5 days ago and introduced heat...I can just imagine what kinda mess this will develop into...not to mention there's no insulation in the attic...it's been below zero during the day for a week...


No insulation in the attic
I would be racing to get it done now, so you won't be stuck fixing everything...

With the pre-fill, you don't fill the bevell, it's just the gap. Plus all board is not created equal. I got to pay attention to the brands more, but some brands are good, don't need a pre-fill, well others leave more of a concave/gap. Which will lead to longer drying times, or a spit line down the road.

Then it also depends if your rockers use screws or nails... nails can make a mess of things, so we will just give the nails a quick spot before we lay tape.


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## Newagestucco (Apr 18, 2012)

getplastered said:


> I've seen this a lot lately too...don't remember it being a problem in the past.
> How the hell can you prefill before tape...I don't prefill and there are spots where tape shows through after my first box coat...wouldn't prefill make it even worse?
> 
> We're doing a house right now that was rained on for two months before it was closed in 2 weeks ago...boarders hung it withought heat a week ago...we started taping 5 days ago and introduced heat...I can just imagine what kinda mess this will develop into...not to mention there's no insulation in the attic...it's been below zero during the day for a week...


 
no insulation in the ceiling not good

if you are heating the place , you are making condensation at the ceiling ,not good especially if the weather is cold outside 
summer your ok 
at this time of the year i would refuse to tape it ,until everything is done properly


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## getplastered (Jan 3, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> No insulation in the attic
> I would be racing to get it done now, so you won't be stuck fixing everything...
> 
> With the pre-fill, you don't fill the bevell, it's just the gap. Plus all board is not created equal. I got to pay attention to the brands more, but some brands are good, don't need a pre-fill, well others leave more of a concave/gap. Which will lead to longer drying times, or a spit line down the road.
> ...


Starting to think my gc cares less and less about my problems down the road than the final draw on the house...I've seen a lot of cracks on upper internals on my last two houses that happened after sand...but before prime....I have a bad feeling about this last one....


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## Philma Crevices (Jan 28, 2012)

Sounds like time to have a talk with him about the exta costs to him and to you from his poor scheduling :whistling2: Tell him 80% of his homes finished areas are subject to cracking and hope we wakes up before he gets a bad name as a builder


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

since this thread is about ridges in the middle of the tape,,,,guess I'll jump in and p!ss everybody off AGAIN !!!!!


I used a banjo for near bout 20 years before I got into the zooka. I like em both, cause when ya tape with em, and wipe em down with a 7" knife,, that leaves a god=awfull looking tape coat.:yes:

I have had countless number of finishers try to enlighten me on how to "fill the bevel" on the tape coat,,,,just to have em look at me strange when i tell em,," I don't want the bevel filled on the tape coat.

Doing it this way,,,,, it don't matter if the tape ridges in or out,,, the bed coat will cover it.

However, if you are one of THEM that has to have a "pretty coat" on each pass,,, this method will NOT work for you...:thumbup:


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## Tim0282 (Jan 8, 2008)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> since this thread is about ridges in the middle of the tape,,,,guess I'll jump in and p!ss everybody off AGAIN !!!!!
> 
> 
> I used a banjo for near bout 20 years before I got into the zooka. I like em both, cause when ya tape with em, and wipe em down with a 7" knife,, that leaves a god=awfull looking tape coat.:yes:
> ...



Totally agree with you, Cpt.! And always good to see you chime in!
Doing it this way,,,,, it don't matter if the tape ridges in or out,,, the bed coat will cover it.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

I don't know...:whistling2:Sometimes they get away from me..


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## getplastered (Jan 3, 2012)

moore said:


> I don't know...:whistling2:Sometimes they get away from me..


I think a more accurate statement is 95% of the time the bed coat will cover it...I agree with Moore. Especially with the new board they're pumping out...I don't find the bevel quite as deep...


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## Gibstopper (Aug 30, 2012)

been plastering for over 25 years now, and yes i still get ridges in the centre tape as well. :-( i have spent a lot of time thinking about this problem, and i have come up with what i think it may be caused by. 
some times the board is good and looks like this __!__ 
some times the board has a slight bevile on the edge and looks like this __/\__
"I" think what the problem is, no matter what plaster or tape we use. when we press in the tape it puts pressure under the tape in the /\ area. over a little time that pressure pushes out the tape causing a ridge in the centre of the tape. i could be wrong, but i can just about guess what jobs will give me problems before i start. 
if anyone can 100% find the cause, please let us all know


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

moore said:


> I don't know...:whistling2:Sometimes they get away from me..


yeah man,,,, sometomes it gets away from all of us. thats just the way it is


just take a minute to think about this,,,,, the farther the tape is DOWN in the bevel, the less problem you have with it


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

What kind of dog ya got there Capt:blink:?


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

moore said:


> What kind of dog ya got there Capt:blink:?


 he's a bonified "Rat Terrorist"


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

I wonder if the ridge is caused by the edges of the tape drying faster than the middle, and the shrinking at the edges causes the middle to pucker.

Anyone ever noticed if it happens more when it's warm vs. when it's cooler?


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## TDI Scott (Feb 26, 2011)

Slim, that is exactly what is happening. The tape is being wiped too tight and pinching the ends as it dries. I have taught alot of guys in my time and have seen this many times.


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

TDI Scott said:


> Slim, that is exactly what is happening. The tape is being wiped too tight and pinching the ends as it dries. I have taught alot of guys in my time and have seen this many times.


So then, pre-filling isn't necessarily the solution to the problem, but is a circumstance under which ridging is less likely to occur because all the mud will be at the same depth and will dry uniformly. Another solution would be a "double-back" over your tape coat, encasing the tape in a uniformly thick layer of mud. 

I've got two approaches to eliminating ridging when doing multiple coats in a day using set-muds. One method is to pre-fill all joints. The other is to go back with another mix of set mud (after tape/top) as it's kicking and hit all the shrinking/ridging then. The second one is becoming my favorite, because the kick from the first batch causes the second batch to go off much faster, if not immediately. Then, comes a skim coat that very often requires little to no check-out/touch-up.

Or, you could go all Harvey on it's ass and spray some foam in the joint before taping. (*Disclaimer: I do NOT recommend applying mud over spray foam. It behaves very unpredictably*)


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Gibstopper said:


> been plastering for over 25 years now, and yes i still get ridges in the centre tape as well. :-( i have spent a lot of time thinking about this problem, and i have come up with what i think it may be caused by.
> some times the board is good and looks like this __!__
> some times the board has a slight bevile on the edge and looks like this __/\__
> "I" think what the problem is, no matter what plaster or tape we use. when we press in the tape it puts pressure under the tape in the /\ area. over a little time that pressure pushes out the tape causing a ridge in the centre of the tape. i could be wrong, but i can just about guess what jobs will give me problems before i start.
> if anyone can 100% find the cause, please let us all know


Well I'm on gibstoppers team:thumbup:

What he is trying to explain here, is what I was trying to explain in post #41, except I was using symbols of.....)( bad ......... ][ ....good

All drywall is not created equal, depending on brands.

Current house were in, had the certainteed CD board on the upper level (trusses 24" o/c), Yet the basement ceiling had laforage 1/2" (I think). We pre-filled the CD board, but not the 1/2" regular, well the garage we did not pre-fill it, What a difference in finish. I will half to run a nail spotter down the middle of the joints in the Garage to fix it. 

Plus if I toss in a old timer story:whistling2:

I remember back in the 80's, we had a drywall strike on, so we had to get drywall from the States. I was a newb back then, but the tapers I was working with were b1tching that they had to pre-fill the rock first. Because the bevell on the American board was more rounded, well ours was More square. So ever since then, I have paid attention to what the bevell is doing.

So I guess it's one part bevell type, then how it dries also. But the pre-fill will give the whole surface of area of the tape equal drying time, and no surprises down the road

So that's my theory :yes:


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## TDI Scott (Feb 26, 2011)

*Slim*

Pre-filling with hot mud is the solution to some of the problems I saw in this thread (gaps in seams) but not really necessary throughout. I will see this problem as well if someone is breaking in a new knife on the tape coat. Knife is too stiff and pinches the ends of the tape. Have you ever had to use any tape that got wet on one side but the other was dry? Like a roll that sat in the bed of your truck. It is a similar thing that is happining here except the ends of the tape are dry while it is staying wet in the center and almost getting soggy.


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## Kiwiman (Jun 14, 2008)

It's all getting a bit technical for my peanut for a brain








Papertape needs more perforations to let air, moisture, and mud through, Hey!, Just use Fibafuse....no more thinking..... problem solved


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## getplastered (Jan 3, 2012)

I gotta get me some of this stuff....


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## getplastered (Jan 3, 2012)

Ok, so went through about 1000 ft of tape today on a new house. Given that we were talking about this ridge in the center of the tape, I thought I would experiment a little. My last two houses had some nasty ridges....a few would not cover after my 12" box and I had to hand tape them an extra coat to hide.

My labour and I both used both sides of the knife and used different angles for wiping. Every other variable was the same except for one thing; this house has been heated for over two weeks before we got in there to start taping.

The result; there were no visible ridges in the tape throughout the entire house except for the ensuit bathroom, where there was about 3 linear feet... And it was minimal. One thing that I found interesting was that the bathroom was the furthest room from the heat source and was rather cold.

So I wonder if temperature has anything to do with the way the mud reacts when taping...just my two cents.


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## Capt-sheetrock (Dec 11, 2009)

getplastered said:


> Ok, so went through about 1000 ft of tape today on a new house. Given that we were talking about this ridge in the center of the tape, I thought I would experiment a little. My last two houses had some nasty ridges....a few would not cover after my 12" box and I had to hand tape them an extra coat to hide.
> 
> My labour and I both used both sides of the knife and used different angles for wiping. Every other variable was the same except for one thing; this house has been heated for over two weeks before we got in there to start taping.
> 
> ...


I find that if the mud drys fast, no problem, if the mud dries slow,,, ridges, ripples, and all other sorts of trouble.

Some techniques, will help in this, some won't. 

We deal with a wet product that is continually exsposed to differant temps,products, and humidity,,,,, yet we somehow think we can make it all turn out the same way everytime,,,,LOL,,,,,we can't


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

capt-sheetrock said:


> i find that if the mud drys fast, no problem, if the mud dries slow,,, ridges, ripples, and all other sorts of trouble.
> 
> Some techniques, will help in this, some won't.
> 
> We deal with a wet product that is continually exsposed to differant temps,products, and humidity,,,,, yet we somehow think we can make it all turn out the same way everytime,,,,lol,,,,,we can't


 thank you!


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## getplastered (Jan 3, 2012)

Capt-sheetrock said:


> I find that if the mud drys fast, no problem, if the mud dries slow,,, ridges, ripples, and all other sorts of trouble.
> 
> Some techniques, will help in this, some won't.
> 
> We deal with a wet product that is continually exsposed to differant temps,products, and humidity,,,,, yet we somehow think we can make it all turn out the same way everytime,,,,LOL,,,,,we can't


That pretty much breaks it down....simple. Funny, before I got on this site, I never really thought about issues I was having while taping...or the processs much...just dealt with it as i went and carried on with my mindless work...now every time something doesn't work like it supposed to I find myself analyzing it and jumping on here trying to find an answer...lol.

Thanks captain!


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

getplastered said:


> Ok, so went through about 1000 ft of tape today on a new house. Given that we were talking about this ridge in the center of the tape, I thought I would experiment a little. My last two houses had some nasty ridges....a few would not cover after my 12" box and I had to hand tape them an extra coat to hide.
> 
> My labour and I both used both sides of the knife and used different angles for wiping. Every other variable was the same except for one thing; this house has been heated for over two weeks before we got in there to start taping.
> 
> ...


Down here getplastered, our DWC wont send us to a house unless the heat has been on for at least 24 hrs minimum. The good builders have heat going well the board is being hung. But sometimes that can't happen with our government run hydro/electricity, their always waiting for hook up:blink:. If you tape the walls when it's cold, we use to call it "the noodle effect", tape acts like a lasagna noodle.

So since your winters are worse where you are,,,,,, still no snow here yet:thumbup:, how about where you are getplastered, is there snow:whistling2:


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## getplastered (Jan 3, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> Down here getplastered, our DWC wont send us to a house unless the heat has been on for at least 24 hrs minimum. The good builders have heat going well the board is being hung. But sometimes that can't happen with our government run hydro/electricity, their always waiting for hook up:blink:. If you tape the walls when it's cold, we use to call it "the noodle effect", tape acts like a lasagna noodle.
> 
> So since your winters are worse where you are,,,,,, still no snow here yet:thumbup:, how about where you are getplastered, is there snow:whistling2:


Nobody cares here 2buck...get the mud on the wall is what I get from my gc. I'm new to this town...only been in business here for barely a year...and I find that the contractors take on more than they can handle, and productivity trumps quality. Deadlines mean more than nice work. Who am I to argue?

And yes we have snow...-20 tonight with about 6" on the ground...at least it's looking like Christmas!

Oh, and my insulation is gettin blown tomorrow! :thumbup:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

getplastered said:


> Nobody cares here 2buck...get the mud on the wall is what I get from my gc. I'm new to this town...only been in business here for barely a year...and I find that the contractors take on more than they can handle, and productivity trumps quality. Deadlines mean more than nice work. Who am I to argue?
> 
> And yes we have snow...-20 tonight with about 6" on the ground...at least it's looking like Christmas!
> 
> Oh, and my insulation is gettin blown tomorrow! :thumbup:


I hear you GP, been there done that, That's why at my age now, I just work for a larger DWC. If I keep my nose clean, do good work (no call backs), then I tend to get the better builders, and follow the better rockers. So I get a wee bit spoiled , except in pay. The prices are written in stone around here.

One year where you are, you just half to play the name game, once your name gets out there, you will get the better builders.

But maybe you should change your signature on this site to , fast and reasonable pricing, instead of slow and expensive,,, they could be watching:jester:


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## getplastered (Jan 3, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> I hear you GP, been there done that, That's why at my age now, I just work for a larger DWC. If I keep my nose clean, do good work (no call backs), then I tend to get the better builders, and follow the better rockers. So I get a wee bit spoiled , except in pay. The prices are written in stone around here.
> 
> One year where you are, you just half to play the name game, once your name gets out there, you will get the better builders.
> 
> But maybe you should change your signature on this site to , fast and reasonable pricing, instead of slow and expensive,,, they could be watching:jester:


He is the best builder in town! Unfortunately, hes also the busiest! He tells me I'm slow, expensive but good...lol

I just find that building standards here are lower than what I'm used to...and I don't want to get that "it's good enough" and "I don't care" attitude cause in small towns your name can go from good to bad over a coffee...


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

getplastered said:


> He is the best builder in town! Unfortunately, hes also the busiest! He tells me I'm slow, expensive but good...lol
> 
> I just find that building standards here are lower than what I'm used to...and I don't want to get that "it's good enough" and "I don't care" attitude cause inI small towns your name can go from good to bad over a coffee...


I work a 5 county area GP your right ...Word travels ..


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## Mudstar (Feb 15, 2008)

TDI Scott said:


> Slim, that is exactly what is happening. The tape is being wiped too tight and pinching the ends as it dries. I have taught alot of guys in my time and have seen this many times.


Bingo :thumbup:


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