# Skim coating a Gloss surface-Questions/Solutions?



## NewWorldArtisan

I am a decorative painter and texturer by trade, though I mostly work in new builds and have never encountered this issue. Done a bit of research and just want to run my solutions by all of you.

I am getting ready to texture and multi-color a salon. The problems? The original wall treatment is some sort of fabric based application. It has since been painted many times with high-gloss paint. The final outcome is a high gloss surface with thousands of 3milx3mil raised squares. Weird, I know...

I use glazes that I tint myself for the multi-color(Faux Effects). So, even if I were to just be painting the wall I would need to de-gloss and/or prime. Where I run into the problem is the need to also skim/retexture and latex before I even do the pretty stuff.

So, my solution is as follows, stop me and yell if you disagree or can add to it.

The original wall treatment is on there and not going anywhere, ever. 

So...
1. Scuff gloss paint with 120 grit
2. double coat with Zinsser BullsEye 1-2-3
3. Skim coat with Green Lid JC, twice minimum
4. Apply hand trowel Sante Fe Style texture(Probably heavier, more dramatic)
5. Coat with Zinsser Bulls Eye 1-2-3 again(Needed?)
6. 2-coat with eggshell latex
7. Paint with glazes

Outside of this solution, how long would I need to let the first 2 coats of primer dry before adding the skim coat over the original wall treatment? Am I an the right path for this project?

Thanks in advance for all of the help!


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## SlimPickins

Hmm, even with scuffing, you're not going to create a mechanical bond in the recessed areas of the squares. Personally, I'd use one coat of oil-based primer (heavily applied), or Sherwin Williams adhesion primer. Then, I'd skim with hot mud with a latex adhesive added (SuperBond, MuddMax, Elmer's). When that is *bone* dry, I'd skim tight with whatever mud you want, and texture after that.

Personally, when I get my finish on, I like to see an oil based primer applied over it, so no moisture from the latex paint can release anything down below. You should be safe because of the initial coat of primer, but if it's high end, insurance is always good.

I've used hot-mud with glue directly over glossy paint, and as long as it has *dried thoroughly* before skim coat it works out great. It WILL delaminate in areas if it's not dry before skim. I promise.....it will.:yes:


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## Mr.Brightstar

Sure I can skimcoat one bedroom for less than $1500. All other estimates were $2500 +.


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## SlimPickins

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Sure I can skimcoat one bedroom for less than $1500. All other estimates were $2500 +.


What the frick happened to those walls?

I just gave an estimate on an old brick townhouse with lots of plaster and wallpaper over plaster and cracks galore.

It's where I decided that I might use insulators' mat (for when they blow fiberglass into the walls) to "tape" the whole surface. It's basically FibaFuse, but much more biggerer.


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## Mr.Brightstar

SlimPickins said:


> What the frick happened to those walls?
> 
> I just gave an estimate on an old brick townhouse with lots of plaster and wallpaper over plaster and cracks galore.
> 
> It's where I decided that I might use insulators' mat (for when they blow fiberglass into the walls) to "tape" the whole surface. It's basically FibaFuse, but much more biggerer.


For stubborn ass wallpaper That doesn't want to come off. Chip the surface With a Plaster's Hatchet, the Basecoat will key into the plaster or drywall. I have used E.I.F.S. mesh before 4 ft x 200ft. It is unnecessary I believe. Repair any cracks before the base coat goes on. And use a hot mud with glue. 

Skim Coating saves Thousands. Capitalize on it. I would be done with this project today if it wasn't so humid.


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## thefinisher

36" rolls of fibafuse..... end of story. :yes:


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## SlimPickins

thefinisher said:


> 36" rolls of fibafuse..... end of story. :yes:


Insulator's mat is just like FF, but just try tearing it apart. It seems way better, I'm going to try and experiment with it.


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## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Sure I can skimcoat one bedroom for less than $1500. All other estimates were $2500 +.


So you just go right over top with Dura ? No taping.. at all?


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## Mr.Brightstar

moore said:


> So you just go right over top with Dura ? No taping.. at all?


Yes no tape. The hairline surface cracks from the cement plaster never make it through the Durabond. If there are deep cracks around windows or doors they get cut and taped.


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## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Yes no tape. The hairline surface cracks from the cement plaster never make it through the Durabond. If there are deep cracks around windows or doors they get cut and taped.


BUT....It needs to be durabond? Right? Will any other hot muds work in that instance as well?:blink:


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## Mr.Brightstar

moore said:


> BUT....It needs to be durabond? Right? Will any other hot muds work in that instance as well?:blink:


Yes, I would only trust Durabond for a base coat in this instance.


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## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Yes, I would only trust Durabond for a base coat in this instance.


:thumbsup: OK! Don't mind me Brightstar Your lunch break is up.
Get back to work!


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## thefinisher

moore said:


> :thumbsup: OK! Don't mind me Brightstar Your lunch break is up.
> Get back to work!


Dang Moore, you have the day off today :whistling2: See you have been posting all day


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## moore

thefinisher said:


> Dang Moore, you have the day off today :whistling2: See you have been posting all day


I took 3 days off.:yes: burnt out/Tired/Body hurts!! 
The next one can wait a few days...fck it..!


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## thefinisher

moore said:


> I took 3 days off.:yes: burnt out/Tired/Body hurts!!
> The next one can wait a few days...fck it..!


Lol never a bad idea. I guess I can post all day too seeing as I can keep track of yall all day with my laptop and mobile wifi :thumbup:


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## Mr.Brightstar

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Sure I can skimcoat one bedroom for less than $1500. All other estimates were $2500 +.


Finally, four days of heat And humidity of 70%. My one day project is dry.


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## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Finally, four days of heat And humidity of 70%. My one day project is dry.


Have you ever tried using a dehumidifier ? They work really well (IMO)
On rainy /humid days the mud is trapped . I couldn't live without mine.:thumbsup:


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## Mr.Brightstar

moore said:


> Have you ever tried using a dehumidifier ? They work really well (IMO)
> On rainy /humid days the mud is trapped . I couldn't live without mine.:thumbsup:


Never tried it. It makes sense. I Usually use a fan but When humidity is high they don't do shi*. 

Might have to pick one up this week. I got same job Different house.


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## icerock drywall

thefinisher said:


> 36" rolls of fibafuse..... end of story. :yes:


I made a nest to hold my 36" roll..it sit off the floor keeping it clean from dirt and hairs and on the leds I use my 18 '' roller to roll my ff :thumbup: that keeps the ff off your head when you work alone


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## thefinisher

good idea. That is the ONLY thing I HATE about Fibafuse. Once it un-rolls itself it does not roll back up . That problem is amplified with the big rolls . The big rolls of fuse help me get away with murder though :yes:.


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## icerock drywall

thefinisher said:


> good idea. That is the ONLY thing I HATE about Fibafuse. Once it un-rolls itself it does not roll back up . That problem is amplified with the big rolls . The big rolls of fuse help me get away with murder though :yes:.



staple it when your done and when you use it on the job tack it


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## rhardman

(Back in the day...before Fibafuse) I was doing a remodel and there was old T&G wood in the entry way that the owner wanted removed and rock installed. Instead of doing all that, I painted the wood and skimmed it fairly tight with hot mud. Then I put door screen over it before the mud set. Another skim and skip trowel. It worked great. 

If you ever run into a lot of flaking wall paper that's hard to get the final areas removed, you can also shellac the surface. It absorbs into the paper and then onto the wall gluing everything down tight. It's shiny so a little sanding would be a good idea before skimming it out. 

:thumbsup:


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## Mr.Brightstar

rhardman said:


> (Back in the day...before Fibafuse) I was doing a remodel and there was old T&G wood in the entry way that the owner wanted removed and rock installed. Instead of doing all that, I painted the wood and skimmed it fairly tight with hot mud. Then I put door screen over it before the mud set. Another skim and skip trowel. It worked great.
> 
> If you ever run into a lot of flaking wall paper that's hard to get the final areas removed, you can also shellac the surface. It absorbs into the paper and then onto the wall gluing everything down tight. It's shiny so a little sanding would be a good idea before skimming it out.
> 
> :thumbsup:


I used to use E.I.F.S. mesh, until a plasterer ask me what makes you think it's going to crack?


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## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> I used to use E.I.F.S. mesh, until a plasterer ask me what makes you think it's going to crack?


I just can't help myself from thinking ,,,,It will.:blink:inch:


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## SlimPickins

Mr.Brightstar said:


> I used to use E.I.F.S. mesh, until a plasterer ask me what makes you think it's going to crack?


Uh....the fact that it already did? I usually get asked to fix plaster cracks, so I put stuff over them. Half of these walls also have a host of other issues....glossy paint, bubbling wallpaper, etc.

However, I've seen hot-mud lock down some pretty intense air bubbles as long as it goes on thick enough.


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## Mr.Brightstar

Durabond. The name says it all.


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## Mr.Brightstar

SlimPickins said:


> Uh....the fact that it already did? I usually get asked to fix plaster cracks, so I put stuff over them. Half of these walls also have a host of other issues....glossy paint, bubbling wallpaper, etc.
> 
> However, I've seen hot-mud lock down some pretty intense air bubbles as long as it goes on thick enough.


Any deep cracks should be cut and taped. Then base and top coat. 

The key to locking down wallpaper Is chipping the surface of the drywall or plaster for the base coat	To key into.


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## Mr.Brightstar

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Any deep cracks should be cut and taped. Then base and top coat.
> 
> The key to locking down wallpaper Is chipping the surface of the drywall or plaster for the base coat	To key into.


No pun intended.


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## moore

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Durabond. The name says it all.


It Is a bad A$$ hot mud!! The best!:yes:


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## icerock drywall

Mr.Brightstar said:


> Any deep cracks should be cut and taped. Then base and top coat.
> 
> The key to locking down wallpaper Is chipping the surface of the drywall or plaster for the base coat	To key into.


I like to Carbi-roto zip to my cracks with a vac.then ap with mesh over cleaned out cracks, after that 36" rolls of ff cover the walls. I did use durabond and like it but now there is FIBAFUSE


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## Mr.Brightstar

High gloss Walls and ceiling,


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## icerock drywall

Mr.Brightstar said:


> High gloss Walls and ceiling,


looks like soot on the walls as well


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## Mr.Brightstar

icerock drywall said:


> looks like soot on the walls as well


 Yes, These walls will definitely be linked.


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