# Curious what others would charge for this.



## Builder46 (Jan 13, 2013)

Someone wants me to remodel their house. Basically it's an old house that WOULD be worth a lot of money had it been kept up. The rooms upstairs are a disaster. 11 foot ceilings and the average room is probably about 15 x 15. All the walls are covered in wallpaper (even the ceiling in one room) and the wallpaper is basically covering plaster walls that are severly cracked. 

I'll have to do everything myself. The house is empty. They want me to remove the wallpaper, then dig out all the cracks (some large portions of the walls will need to be chipped out down to the lath since they are cracked and jutting out) and the corners are all cracked from floor to ceiling etc, then they want me to fill the cracks and skim coat the whole thing with Durabond 90, then sand. In the end they want nice smooth walls ready to paint. The ceilings have to be done too since they are pretty severely cracked also. As I said they are 11 foot ceilings.

It will all be done by hand. I don't have any expensive taping tools. Just a hawk and trowel and a ladder. There is scaffold here but it's pretty much useless because you can only put the planks on the top level.
There are 3 rooms and I'm just curious how much others would charge if they were in a similar situation (assuming you would take the job). I have to remove the wallpaper, fix the walls, skim coat, then sand and touch up. Painting and floors etc we'll worry about later.


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

i would for my own sake highly recommend by the hour. if they wanted a fixed price i would make my estimate based on every worst case scenario. you should assume the wallpaper will be a bitch to remove. assume the plaster will be in worse shape than it looks like under the wall paper. once you start removing unsound plaster it just keeps going. just thoroughly outline every phase of the job and estimate what each phase will cost in the worst case and what it will cost if it goes smoothly. example: wallpaper removal and priming $700 -$1000. if you come in under on a phase cut the price and share a little. only you know what this job looks like and what your local prices are. all we can do is help you think of what could go wrong and help avoid making an expensive mistake. 

also i would do this whole job by hand. maybe use my flushers to tape angles but it would not impact the cost much to do it by hand on a job of that size.

good luck. these would be the terms i would take it on or i would tell them to get so and so's uncle who is so good he doesn't even sand:jester:


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

oh yeah and get a usefull baker scaffold on the job you will cost five times that farting around without one.


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## Builder46 (Jan 13, 2013)

Al I really need is Durabond as far as materials go. Durabond and Tape I guess. The home owner is going to deliver the durabond as I need it and I wont be paying for any materials.
It's just the labor I'm charging for. 

Reno's suck. I have friends who just refuse to do reno's completely. Homeowners tend to think their job is easy because the house is already built and all you're doing is repairing it. lol
Meanwhile I could probably drywall 3 houses with a partner in the time it takes to do one room.
Everything in this house has been fixed the easy way and it shows. (for instance wallpaper over cracking walls) so it's hard to explain to people that the difference between what I'm doing and what they've been doing is like night and day.

Originally they thought it would be fine to just repaint over the wallpaper (which is actually peeling in places) :thumbup:
(The house is being rennovated to sell, already one summer on the market and no takers)


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

F that.... I would put 1/4" board over all of it and have new walls! Did something similar to one room a while back which was about 12x12 I guess. Had wall paper over textured (popcorn looking) plaster that just wasn't coming off. The builder put some red type of sealant/paint over the paper and I solid skimmed out the walls completely. Used 3 bags of 45 minute, 1 bag of 5 minute and almost a half a bucket of mud. Also put nocoat in the angles to make them sharp again. Also, all of the trim was still on so I had to cut all that in which was a pain since there was 2 windows and 3 door openings go figure in one room. All in all it took about 8-9 hours to do overall and I think we charged $900 to do it. I will say that the walls came out like glass though :yes:


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

Honestly I would probably charge them around $500 a room to do it as it seems like a lot of work.


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## Perkcon (Nov 25, 2012)

Be careful just skim coating a cracked plaster wall is like paving over a bad road, it looks good for a while. You might want to get some 24" or 36" self adhesive mesh on the walls before skim coating. First off feel out the home owners if you get a bad vibe that they are cheap. Run away.


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## CatD7 (Jul 25, 2011)

Demo down to the studs and start over.:thumbsup:


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## fenez (Nov 30, 2009)

Remove the paper, put a bonding agent on the walls such as plaster weld, then take out whatever is loose mesh tape all the cracks or fiber fuse them, then veneer plaster everything, that is the proper job over existing plaster.


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## jcampbell (Aug 26, 2012)

CatD7 said:


> Demo down to the studs and start over.:thumbsup:


There's the correct answer!


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

fenez's approach is the one i was thinking. or you could board the ceiling with half inch and then skim the walls. 500 a room sounds like peanuts to me. i wouldn't touch it for less than double that. but then again the average price for a house in my area is $1,000,000 so that dramaticaly effects cost of living


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

carpentaper said:


> fenez's approach is the one i was thinking. or you could board the ceiling with half inch and then skim the walls. 500 a room sounds like peanuts to me. i wouldn't touch it for less than double that. but then again the average price for a house in my area is $1,000,000 so that dramaticaly effects cost of living


I thought $500 a room sounded like peanuts also.

I too agree with getting a baker....you can pick up a pretty good one for $200....roll it into the cost if you have to, or at least have them pay for half (it'll last forever). 

Sometimes, these plaster jobs aren't worth fixing....you need to explain that if the plaster is in bad enough shape it's just a hazard (and a lawsuit) waiting to happen....that will help turn the folks just looking to flip a shady deal over on an unsuspecting buyer. 

There's a guy I know who bids things this way....

He works the job from start to finish, estimating time and materials.
Then he works backwards, doing the same thing. Then he compares the two, looking for any glaring inconsistencies. After he reaches a number he feels confident with..........he doubles it.

There's no point in losing your ass with a solid number on something like this. Time and materials (with a percentage added on) or a very high bid. You can do it right, or you can not do it....right?


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## CatD7 (Jul 25, 2011)

jcampbell said:


> There's the correct answer!


 

Yep, tear down to the studs. I have an electrician buddy that says a rewire is a third the cost is the rooms are teared down to the studs. It would be a good time for them to check into to rewiring as well! Get two birds stoned at once.

Old houses cost money to own.


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## Builder46 (Jan 13, 2013)

The walls have not been touched for over 100 years. Considerring that I guess you could say they've held up well. 
The owners seem afraid of this turning into a massive construction project and shoot down any idea that sounds too committed. Any idea that seems to "involved" to them just sort of fizzles out and dies. Hauling away tons of rubble and ordering drywall (and having it delivered, etc) is never going to fly. Plus I'd need another guy to help me with the ceilings and I'd need a baker or two, box of screws. 
I'd have to take the baseboard and mouldings off to do drywall too and I really don't want to screw around with that stuff. It's irreplaceable century old wood and if anything goes wrong it will be quite obviouse. 
I agree that $500 per room is nothing. That's the kind of price a person charges to get the job and then quits halfway through because they're making about $3.00 an hour. 
Think about it. How much would you charge to scrape wallpaper off the walls of a large room with 11 foot high ceilings? This is before you can even START the real work.


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

Builder46 said:


> The walls have not been touched for over 100 years. Considerring that I guess you could say they've held up well.
> The owners seem afraid of this turning into a massive construction project and shoot down any idea that sounds too committed. Any idea that seems to "involved" to them just sort of fizzles out and dies. Hauling away tons of rubble and ordering drywall (and having it delivered, etc) is never going to fly. Plus I'd need another guy to help me with the ceilings and I'd need a baker or two, box of screws.
> I'd have to take the baseboard and mouldings off to do drywall too and I really don't want to screw around with that stuff. It's irreplaceable century old wood and if anything goes wrong it will be quite obviouse.
> I agree that $500 per room is nothing. That's the kind of price a person charges to get the job and then quits halfway through because they're making about $3.00 an hour.
> Think about it. How much would you charge to scrape wallpaper off the walls of a large room with 11 foot high ceilings? This is before you can even START the real work.


Just remember, you need to make sure the substrate is locked down before you coat over it. Let's have an example....

You lean a sheet of OSB up against a doorway, and you put some Tyvek and siding on it. Then someone comes along and pushes the OSB over. What's the problem? The siding looked great on there!

If the plaster is solid, great. Coat away. There are lots of things you can do to make it bulletproof, if you're willing to put in the effort. You can get wide Fibafuse, or EIFS mesh and make a strong solid skim. Or you can dig out the cracks, prime them, and then tape them and skim everything. Only you know what you want to get paid for doing the job, and whether you want to make a profit or not. No one here is going to price your job for you, they can only give you ballpark estimates on what they might conceivably charge to do a similar job....in their location.....in their market.....with their rate of pay.

It sounds like your options are very limited in what you'll be allowed to do. When I'm confronted with that scenario I say "Oh, okay....I think you're looking for someone else. Thank you very much for the opportunity though."


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

just to tear the wallpaper off and put the plasterweld on could take two days.theres $600- $800 right off the bat just in labour depending on what you like to make per hour. it would take another day to repair all the cracks(just up to tape). then it would be two coats of all purpose( for me cause i'm a drywall finisher not a plasterer). then sand it all out and cleanup. it could be done in one week with adequate heat. labour only i would be tempted to ask for $2000 minimum. that does not include prime after sand and only if the walls are mostly stable enough to coat over.


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## chris (Apr 13, 2011)

From the sounds of it I would recommend an oil base . Prep wall as best you can without mudding ( scraping loose plaster, loose paper,real rough sand) then hose her down with some oil and let dry 2 days. Come back and finish normally using taping mud and all purpose. Just tape all the cracks and flatten/float the best you can then skim. Ive renovated 3 out of the 4 floors at our county courthouse and the walls sound similar. I didnt bother trying to remove all the paper ,,, there was too much and the walls were fragile. The painter hosed it down (oil base) and it dried hard as a rock:thumbsup:. Only one floor left to do,,someday


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Builder46 said:


> Someone wants me to remodel their house. Basically it's an old house that WOULD be worth a lot of money had it been kept up. The rooms upstairs are a disaster. 11 foot ceilings and the average room is probably about 15 x 15. All the walls are covered in wallpaper (even the ceiling in one room) and the wallpaper is basically covering plaster walls that are severly cracked.
> 
> I'll have to do everything myself. The house is empty. They want me to remove the wallpaper, then dig out all the cracks (some large portions of the walls will need to be chipped out down to the lath since they are cracked and jutting out) and the corners are all cracked from floor to ceiling etc, then they want me to fill the cracks and skim coat the whole thing with Durabond 90, then sand. In the end they want nice smooth walls ready to paint. The ceilings have to be done too since they are pretty severely cracked also. As I said they are 11 foot ceilings.
> 
> ...


Post numbers #2,#9, and #17 seem to be your options ,since they don't want to do a re-do .

Only other option is to convince to H.O. to find someone to remove the wall paper for you, or convince them to remove it themselves. I did jobs like your doing when I was young. You will find people have little time but are rich , or have lots of time but are poor. If your dealing with people who make around the same income as you, then they have more time on their hands than they would like to admit. So feed them a option. 600 to remove paper, 500 to fix walls, watch how fast they volunteer to remove the paper for you


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

carpentaper said:


> just to tear the wallpaper off and put the plasterweld on could take two days.theres $600- $800 right off the bat just in labour depending on what you like to make per hour. it would take another day to repair all the cracks(just up to tape). then it would be two coats of all purpose( for me cause i'm a drywall finisher not a plasterer). then sand it all out and cleanup. it could be done in one week with adequate heat. labour only i would be tempted to ask for $2000 minimum. that does not include prime after sand and only if the walls are mostly stable enough to coat over.


And I think that is cheap lol. It was my understanding there were several different "rooms"? Don't care if it is a bathroom, living room, bedroom, closet...... $500 per space :yes:. If it was just a couple rooms then I would charge about $1000 per room for labor. Wouldn't be nothing for materials.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

thefinisher said:


> And I think that is cheap lol. It was my understanding there were several different "rooms"? Don't care if it is a bathroom, living room, bedroom, closet...... $500 per space :yes:. If it was just a couple rooms then I would charge about $1000 per room for labor. Wouldn't be nothing for materials.


 How much will your Mexicans get per room??


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

moore said:


> How much will your Mexicans get per room??


Alot!!!! Small jobs and renovations are totally off the map for pricing. There is no set price per board or square foot when it comes to these. Often things like this we will pay $10+ a board depending on the size of the job.


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## SlimPickins (Aug 10, 2010)

thefinisher said:


> Alot!!!! Small jobs and renovations are totally off the map for pricing. There is no set price per board or square foot when it comes to these. Often things like this we will pay $10+ a board depending on the size of the job.


So 10 sheets is $100? :blink:


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

thefinisher said:


> And I think that is cheap lol. It was my understanding there were several different "rooms"? Don't care if it is a bathroom, living room, bedroom, closet...... $500 per space :yes:. If it was just a couple rooms then I would charge about $1000 per room for labor. Wouldn't be nothing for materials.


1000 per room for three rooms should be a nice safe estimate(labour only). i wouldn't be panicking at every little thing that took a little longer.


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## thefinisher (Sep 2, 2011)

SlimPickins said:


> So 10 sheets is $100? :blink:


No we would probably pay about $400-$500 to hang 10 sheets depending on how hard it is, location, and if they have to carry sheets upstairs at all. It really depends on the job. If it is a simple 10 sheets that will take an hour then probably $250.


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## Mr.Brightstar (Dec 2, 2011)

Builder46 said:


> Someone wants me to remodel their house. Basically it's an old house that WOULD be worth a lot of money had it been kept up. The rooms upstairs are a disaster. 11 foot ceilings and the average room is probably about 15 x 15. All the walls are covered in wallpaper (even the ceiling in one room) and the wallpaper is basically covering plaster walls that are severly cracked.
> 
> I'll have to do everything myself. The house is empty. They want me to remove the wallpaper, then dig out all the cracks (some large portions of the walls will need to be chipped out down to the lath since they are cracked and jutting out) and the corners are all cracked from floor to ceiling etc, then they want me to fill the cracks and skim coat the whole thing with Durabond 90, then sand. In the end they want nice smooth walls ready to paint. The ceilings have to be done too since they are pretty severely cracked also. As I said they are 11 foot ceilings.
> 
> ...


 $700 first room, $500 each additional room.


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