# The Next Step



## taper71 (Dec 9, 2007)

I have been drywalling for 16 years . Worked for experienced guys for 12 of them with doing some small stuff on the side on my own. I have been subbing for some of the bigger Drywall Contractors for the last 4 years now and really am getting sick of their bull crap. I know I am not the best , but I do some nice work , show up every day,fast, reliable and clean and get paid the same rate as the crack heads and drunks who do shoddy work at best and take 3 weeks to a month to complete jobs. I even go so far as to fix anything that is my fault even after I have been paid ,at my own expense. Problem is that I get treated as badly as the guys out there wrecking it for eveybody else. Not by the builders , but by the drywall contractors themselves. I think they make more profit by taking 15% off the drunks and crackheads pay for taking advances. 

I really want to start cutting out the Drywall Contractors and work Directly for the Builders now. I do not want to be big just busy enough to pay the bills and retire one day. I have been aproached lots to do work on the side, but always refuse because I do not do cash deals and have no WCB #. I would like to be legit and have my own liability insurance ,but no WCB. ( The Drywall Contractors cover that as an expense ). My biggest fear is not being paid and not having the capital to cover it, and the worst one is hiring subs to do the insulating and boarding end of it .

Sorry for the long post I think I just need to vent.


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## savant (Dec 19, 2007)

I dont know Canadian laws, but worker's comp is not a huge amount of money. You probably can get it written to cover yourself, and offer only finishing services.


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## cooper (Apr 6, 2008)

If you get paid the same as someone who takes twice as long then you effectively get paid more. 

So WCB is workman's comp? You do not need to have it to operate your business, at least not my state. But if it is typically figured into the cost of a job, why not have it? 

As to avoid not getting paid... Take some time to investigate these builders that want you to bid their houses. Notice how many houses they have built, for sale at the time, how many they have sold recently, stuff like that. Ask around, see if anyone else has had problems with them... 

And hiring a hanger really isn't that tough. I'm sure you've made a couple 'hanger' friends taping for that many years...


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## Drywall1 (Dec 9, 2007)

Just make sure you have a game plan worked out and talk to a banker. A reserve line of credit is worth its weight in gold. That way you don't have to be a "nagging drywaller" asking for money right after your job is done. Start doing some talking to builders, hangers, insulators, and even other tapers. Just a few ideas for ya to ponder. Do it your way and giver hell.


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## taper71 (Dec 9, 2007)

I have applied for a wcb # . I guess I can opt out paying and get private insurance which is what I want anyways. I still need it for hiring employees and will have to pay for any I hire, but that is okay.I have a meeting with a builder next week and another builder I have finished for has no problems giving me his homes. These are guys that build 4 or 5 custom homes per year so its a start. The bigger guys treat these builders like crap so bad for them good for me. Now I got to go hunt for a lawyer.


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## cooper (Apr 6, 2008)

What do you need a lawyer for? Or is that standard practice in Canada?


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## KingOfDrywall (May 15, 2008)

*A word of caution......*

It's common practice (at least in Ohio and PA) for you to complete a job, than the General Contractor asks for your proof of insurance........ and he says "he can't pay you unless you show proof of insurance"...... ((that's my favorite line LMAO!!)) We just did a Walmart Super Center in Warren Ohio and every time my guys got near completeing an area....the general would pull them away and tell them to start somewhere else. His strategY was: keep me from completeing an area so I couldn't properly bill him for it. After about 1 week I pulled my crew off the job. When I invoiced him he said he needed my insurance, which I submitted, than workers comp. which I submitted......than he said he noticed that the name on my insurance certificate is not "Drywall king".
I responded and said. not a problem....It has my corporate name, my personal name, and it specifically states it covers all my D.B.A's. He says and I quote "I don't think his insurance company will let me pay this".....I broke out laughing and said since when does your insurance company cut your check. In short, I took him to court and the judge specifically outlined the law and said that "with holding funds or money owed, in an effort to gain company compliance-resolution, is prohibited under Ohio and PA labor laws". In summary......the Judge ordered him to pay and the issue was resolved. I heard several other contractors got screwed on that walmart.....he used the same-similar lines on all of them. He would say stuff like......oh....your insurance papers aren't in order or he'd tell them he needed a bond and he assumed they knew. What a scammer!!


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## evolve991 (Jan 24, 2008)

Hey Taper we hang more for finishers than for GCs these days. If they pay and don't have the typical hanger/finisher personality conflict its actually better for us since there are less ways for the GC to play games with the money.


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## joepro0000 (Jun 14, 2008)

Drywall King,

What Builder was that from Ohio? I been working with a few lately, in S.Florida.

James Hunt Construction
Constructione One
Prodigy Construction


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## joepro0000 (Jun 14, 2008)

Taper,

I would def. try it. You don't have to have W.C. for the hangers if there subs, 1099's and have their own. I was in the same situation 4 years ago, and been doing fine. Establish a relationship with the builders, become their priority contractor, frame-hang-finish, or hang & finish. -


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## KingOfDrywall (May 15, 2008)

Hey JoePro- The builder was B.U.H. Construction out of McKees Rock PA.
Technically he was the last on to play this game with me. When I first got into business on my own, home builders would do it constantly to me. My solution over the years was very simple...IMMEDIATE COURT ACTION!!. Whether I like you or not whether you're having money problems or not, if we are not paid on time we immediately file legal action. That way it's legal -on papper that they have not paid within the time period and than they can't make excuses and say workmanship was questionable or that there were other issues etc. It makes you out to be a prick, but who's the real prick? the guy who did a good job and is owed money, or the people who aren't paying? I won't even give notice before filing civil action. 1 notice is all they get & I bet they pay their mortgage,credit cards & and car payments on time. This week I am filing against Brinks Home Security in Youngstown. A tech "Ron", put his foot through a ceiling when installing an alarm. They called us out to do the repairs and I explained to them to have a check issued immediately. That was 10 days ago.
Now they'll owe me filing fees and interest on top of the pricipal. Oh well.....what else am I gonna do.? All of a sudden this "Ron" is like a ghost installer.....LMAO!! He works there......they just can't tell me where....lol


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## joepro0000 (Jun 14, 2008)

How do you feel a notice to owner form, or where can you get it online?


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## KingOfDrywall (May 15, 2008)

I'm not sure I'm familiar with that. What's it's purpose?


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## silverstilts (Oct 15, 2008)

taper71 said:


> I have been drywalling for 16 years . Worked for experienced guys for 12 of them with doing some small stuff on the side on my own. I have been subbing for some of the bigger Drywall Contractors for the last 4 years now and really am getting sick of their bull crap. I know I am not the best , but I do some nice work , show up every day,fast, reliable and clean and get paid the same rate as the crack heads and drunks who do shoddy work at best and take 3 weeks to a month to complete jobs. I even go so far as to fix anything that is my fault even after I have been paid ,at my own expense. Problem is that I get treated as badly as the guys out there wrecking it for eveybody else. Not by the builders , but by the drywall contractors themselves. I think they make more profit by taking 15% off the drunks and crackheads pay for taking advances.
> 
> I really want to start cutting out the Drywall Contractors and work Directly for the Builders now. I do not want to be big just busy enough to pay the bills and retire one day. I have been aproached lots to do work on the side, but always refuse because I do not do cash deals and have no WCB #. I would like to be legit and have my own liability insurance ,but no WCB. ( The Drywall Contractors cover that as an expense ). My biggest fear is not being paid and not having the capital to cover it, and the worst one is hiring subs to do the insulating and boarding end of it .
> 
> Sorry for the long post I think I just need to vent.


 Buy cutting out the drywall contractors and working for a general contractor you become a contractor yourself... as far as not getting paid the instant you are done well welcome to the world of being a subcontractor.... and also along with all the other expenses of hiring others to hang the board or whatever help you may need....and being accountable for them , in the long run it is good if one is persistent , it may take some time ( a couple of years ) and can be a bumpy road to get a business going but hang in there soon enough you will find the so called good contractors to work for the ones who will take good care of you because they value your work and work ethics...


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