# 3 coats? what for?



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

Who says you need 3 coats?

Taped and blocked


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

Skimmed


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

The skim is basically a piss coat for sanding.


----------



## Mr.Brightstar (Dec 2, 2011)

What did you use for your base coat?


️http://youtu.be/Fb2OdLICjFk


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

Pro form lite 45


----------



## Bevelation (Dec 20, 2008)

I almost never 3 coat my flats. But what about butts that swell and beads that shrink?


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Dont get me wrong i have done it before when using mesh tape doing one coat of base and then a nice top but that was on a dirty cheap housing estate and there was no money so we pushed the limits but i dont know if i would try it on the houses i do atm where they light up every wall and circle imperfections make u fix it then back charge for painting lol


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Thats what i love about ff i run it in on a but let it sit there for 10 or so mins run other buts then come back and coat it scrape it back lots of times as good as a second coated but


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Thats after ff run in on buts as ff is run with sloppy mud before the hot mud goes off they have set and tack dried then with same mix fo over them


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

All this is tape coat and one top only.............That's all they wanted, Turned out ok but not as good as the third coated seams.


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Very nice mate they just wanted a factory finish lol


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

embella plaster said:


> Very nice mate they just wanted a factory finish lol


 They actually only wanted tape coat then two coats of paint, Yuck, Managed to squeeze the second coat and a sand out them.


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Good thing you did as your name is still on it


----------



## cazna (Mar 28, 2010)

embella plaster said:


> Good thing you did as your name is still on it


 Dam straight brother :thumbsup:


----------



## Aussiecontractor (Oct 6, 2014)

Mmmmmmmm metres!! ...... Embella, that looks pretty ****ed working around that furniture mate ! 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Oh yeah hoarders dont worry thats a 4k ceiling


----------



## Bazooka-Joe (Dec 31, 2010)

embella plaster said:


> Dont get me wrong i have done it before when using mesh tape doing one coat of base and then a nice top but that was on a dirty cheap housing estate and there was no money so we pushed the limits but i dont know if i would try it on the houses i do atm where they light up every wall and circle imperfections make u fix it then back charge for painting lol


my 3rd coat gives me satisfaction to tell the DWC to Five himself if he thinks my work is not good, mind u never a complaint. 

fill Bevel 2 on top for my flats...

I dont drive around to fix anything it s done it s done,

Dont tell Gaz he will put the Finga on me for sure,







and want a Video


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

I have seen guys pass a really good job with 2 coats but bottom line the thread is 3 coats what for?........absolute perfection


----------



## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

embella plaster said:


> I have seen guys pass a really good job with 2 coats but bottom line the thread is 3 coats what for?........absolute perfection


And to hide the tape line ! Sand paper don't solve everything !


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

What tape line?


----------



## Mr.Brightstar (Dec 2, 2011)

3 coats For the bad spots. 


️http://youtu.be/Fb2OdLICjFk


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

And you guys gonna think this sounds dumb cause its level 4 finish......but i do 3 coats on my work once i am done using high quality board....high quality compounds...high quality sanding looks as good as level 5 and that is achievable with well done joins at 3 coats well done nails and well done hollowed out butts which all my butts are 3 mm centre hollow before tape applied


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

Butt boards?


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Nope i use metal battons smacking them lightlt in the middle smack to hard u get a 10mm hollow.....as i said per sheet i apply 4 hit and bent cletes gives same affect as but board


----------



## Bazooka-Joe (Dec 31, 2010)

embella plaster said:


> I have seen guys pass a really good job with 2 coats but bottom line the thread is 3 coats what for?........absolute perfection


yes it is possible and did it years ago, most of the time it was great add cold slight shrinkage had to drive an hour plus pack up to fix a shrunk bead bowed butt


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Sometimes its just not worth the shortcut :thumbup:


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

But kudos to you fr8 looks great


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

Most of our work is within a 30 min drive. On the rare occasion there is a problem, it is usually heat related. I.e., no heat/not enough/wrong kind/attic wasn't blown/we left and they turned off the heat.


----------



## Aussiecontractor (Oct 6, 2014)

embella plaster said:


> Nope i use metal battons smacking them lightlt in the middle smack to hard u get a 10mm hollow.....as i said per sheet i apply 4 hit and bent cletes gives same affect as but board



Yeah we do that one if no battens around I use timber with a screw. In each end back block them and peak it with a screw in the recess to hold it in place until the mud sets 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## keke (Mar 7, 2012)

fr8train said:


> Butt boards?





embella plaster said:


> Nope i use metal battons smacking them lightlt in the middle smack to hard u get a 10mm hollow.....as i said per sheet i apply 4 hit and bent cletes gives same affect as but board


that's the way to go and this is the result fr8train


----------



## Aussiecontractor (Oct 6, 2014)

I do simillar to that, but instead of corner fixings on diagonal I put a back block over it instead..but mud the whole back block and the other 3


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

Those But Boards were super quick though. No need to muck around with 4 bits of batten and no back blocking.


----------



## Aussiecontractor (Oct 6, 2014)

Did you guys ever see that butt joint bead.....you left a small gap between butt then slide this bead over the sheet similar to a h mold but a flush bead. once in place it had a screw installed and as you would screw it up it would peak your joints then you just flushed it no tape nothing 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

Yes, I used them once on a flat roof place because we could not get access to back block properly. I was not that impressed very fiddly and not cheap.


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Do they still have butt board hear in aus


----------



## Aussiecontractor (Oct 6, 2014)

gazman said:


> Yes, I used them once on a flat roof place because we could not get access to back block properly. I was not that impressed very fiddly and not cheap.



Yer I didn't like the look of them either 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

embella plaster said:


> Do they still have butt board hear in aus


No. Due to AU standards saying that back blocking is needed.:furious:


----------



## D A Drywall (May 4, 2013)

Aussiecontractor said:


> Mmmmmmmm metres!! ...... Embella, that looks pretty ****ed working around that furniture mate !
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I see he has customers like mine: "Don't worry- we will have this room cleared out before you start"
Then you get there to start and they say:"Sorry didn't get it done but it shouldn't be a problem for you to work around this"
That's when I gob the mud on and sand the heck out of it and not with my vac sander either!


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

Use your vac sander, just without the vacuum! :yes:


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

gazman said:


> No. Due to AU standards saying that back blocking is needed.:furious:


The right palms didn't get greased, eh?


----------



## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

fr8train said:


> The right palms didn't get greased, eh?


Probably. The only reason that back blocking became AU standard was that a national builder was using sub standard methods, and the drywall industry had to compensate for their inadequacies.


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

It ****s you to tears i understand a butt join cracking with mesh tape and no peaking like it only has 2 mm of base coat covering it with crap tape .....but but board hollows it wich allows at least 5 mm centre of mud making it strong as anything and a solid piece of board locking the sheets together i would put my guarentee to that any day


----------



## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

embella plaster said:


> It ****s you to tears i understand a butt join cracking with mesh tape and no peaking like it only has 2 mm of base coat covering it with crap tape .....but but board hollows it wich allows at least 5 mm centre of mud making it strong as anything and a solid piece of board locking the sheets together i would put my guarentee to that any day


Definitely, and add Fiba Fuse as well and you have a winner.


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

gazman said:


> Definitely, and add Fiba Fuse as well and you have a winner.


Thats the ticket gaz now i have used it trust nothing else


----------



## Sweendog87 (Apr 5, 2015)

gazman said:


> No. Due to AU standards saying that back blocking is needed.:furious:


Yet when we set and other guys pin on commercial sites with million $$$ units they still w don't back block 😤


----------



## Sweendog87 (Apr 5, 2015)

gazman said:


> Probably. The only reason that back blocking became AU standard was that a national builder was using sub standard methods, and the drywall industry had to compensate for their inadequacies.


****!ng chippies always make our Job harder most said thing by a chippy the plasterer will fix it 😤


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Yeah cause we always fix there mums lol


----------



## VANMAN (Jan 14, 2011)

Can't remember the last time I 3 coated a house!:blink:
I just use the 2Buck method of boxing a room say then double back and do it again!:thumbsup: (That's the 8 I double) finish with the 12.
And I have had no probs at all!:thumbup:


----------



## jeepin270 (Mar 30, 2014)

The reason y 3 coats isn't necessary is because your probably using rapid coat


----------



## Oldtimer (May 6, 2015)

For me it's 2 coats on flats/inside corners and 3 on everything else. The bevel on the flats gets filled when I wipe down the tape so 2 coats after is enough for a nice finish.


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

jeepin270 said:


> The reason y 3 coats isn't necessary is because your probably using rapid coat


Spot on!


----------



## endo_alley (Nov 2, 2013)

fr8train said:


> Who says you need 3 coats?
> 
> Taped and blocked
> View attachment 17785
> ...


I am not worthy.


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Oldtimer said:


> For me it's 2 coats on flats/inside corners and 3 on everything else. The bevel on the flats gets filled when I wipe down the tape so 2 coats after is enough for a nice finish.


Are u saying u do 2 coats after running the tape....because i count the tape being run as a coat so 2 coats after that i call 3


----------



## fr8train (Jan 20, 2008)

embella plaster said:


> Are u saying u do 2 coats after running the tape....because i count the tape being run as a coat so 2 coats after that i call 3


I do tape plus 2 coats. Some guys do tape plus 3 coats


----------



## Sweendog87 (Apr 5, 2015)

I thought the same but realised that they don't count the tape as a "coat" per say so 3 coat is really 4 actual coats of we only coat an extra for butts if they need it otherwise tape and 2 coat


----------



## gazman (Apr 29, 2011)

For us it depends upon who the job is for and how much they are paying. Project builders get , tape, second coat, and top. Every one else gets a 12" skim as well.


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Ok well i guess it is 4 when i run my banjo with fibrefuse only bedding it in not filling it but i then go over straight away once they have all been run with a 6 inch but i called that the one coat as straight away 6 inch over the still wet fibefuse beded in tape


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Project builders method
*mesh tape
*8 inch box hot mud first and only base
*12 inch top
Sand if i am in the mood lol


----------



## Sweendog87 (Apr 5, 2015)

gazman said:


> For us it depends upon who the job is for and how much they are paying. Project builders get , tape, second coat, and top. Every one else gets a 12" skim as well.


Only if they pay on time hey gazman👍


----------



## Oldtimer (May 6, 2015)

Yes, Embella. That's 2 coats after the tapes are on, so I guess that would be 3


----------



## embella plaster (Sep 21, 2013)

Yeah its funny international terms pretty much every aussi calls tape coat a coat


----------



## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

embella plaster said:


> Yeah its funny international terms pretty much every aussi calls tape coat a coat


Tape coat 
Block coat
Skim coat 

Then the extras ! Without the extras Your just a 3 coater!


----------



## endo_alley (Nov 2, 2013)

We in Colorado all say tape, first coat (or fill coat) and second coat (or finish coat) . When I go back to the east coast of the US, I get confused about the terminology. Or more specifically (and realistally) what I hear around here lately is Tepiar, primeriar, y segundiar.


----------



## Bazooka-Joe (Dec 31, 2010)

VANMAN said:


> Can't remember the last time I 3 coated a house!:blink:
> I just use the 2Buck method of boxing a room say then double back and do it again!:thumbsup: (That's the 8 I double) finish with the 12.
> And I have had no probs at all!:thumbup:


yeah tubebucks method to me is time consuming, I mix my mud the day before I box, when it sits long it goes on like a hand in a velvet glove..








least the mud around here it works well, one flash down the wall not running but steady:thumbsup:


----------



## Bazooka-Joe (Dec 31, 2010)

endo_alley said:


> We in Colorado all say tape, first coat (or fill coat) and second coat (or finish coat) . When I go back to the east coast of the US, I get confused about the terminology. Or more specifically (and realistally) what I hear around here lately is Tepiar, primeriar, y segundiar.



hows this Chicago Knockdown, heard some boys call it that:jester:


----------



## VANMAN (Jan 14, 2011)

Bazooka-Joe said:


> yeah tubebucks method to me is time consuming, I mix my mud the day before I box, when it sits long it goes on like a hand in a velvet glove..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Never tried mixing the mud the day before!
Maybe have to try that 1!:thumbsup:


----------



## KandTTaping (Nov 1, 2015)

I don't use paper on my joints. Mesh and hot mud or quick mud is used then paper and bead all wid hot mud and coat the angles wid hot mud and skim all wid bucket mud and sand get paid


----------



## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

KandTTaping said:


> I don't use paper on my joints. Mesh and hot mud or quick mud is used then paper and bead all wid hot mud and coat the angles wid hot mud and skim all wid bucket mud and sand get paid


So they pay you for that ?


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

VANMAN said:


> Never tried mixing the mud the day before!
> Maybe have to try that 1!:thumbsup:


Some mud that gets sent to my jobs, it can be a good help. I'll sometimes mix up to 3 pails the night before, and keep mixing new ones as I go through each pail, if the job is big enough to need it. The mud can keep setting up too much too soon, otherwise, before I get through a pail.


----------



## Mudstar (Feb 15, 2008)

JustMe said:


> Some mud that gets sent to my jobs, it can be a good help. I'll sometimes mix up to 3 pails the night before, and keep mixing new ones as I go through each pail, if the job is big enough to need it. The mud can keep setting up too much too soon, otherwise, before I get through a pail.


 A pail last me 1/2 hour tops. Whats taking you so long that its starts setting up


----------



## Bazooka-Joe (Dec 31, 2010)

embella plaster said:


> I have seen guys pass a really good job with 2 coats but bottom line the thread is 3 coats what for?........absolute perfection



if ya fill bevel as you wipe tape and 2 on top that's three is it not, just think dem blokes say it differently


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

Mudstar said:


> A pail last me 1/2 hour tops. Whats taking you so long that its starts setting up


 10-15 minutes from mixing can have a noticeable enough difference at times that I don't care to work with it without remixing. Can do that again if working with things that are taking time to use the mud up.

If a pail never lasts you more than 1/2 hour, sounds like you've got easy jobs, and someone to take care of the small stuff.


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

JustMe said:


> If a pail never lasts you more than 1/2 hour, sounds like you've got easy jobs, and someone to take care of the small stuff.


 I should add :thumbsup:. I could use more of that, already.


----------



## Mudstar (Feb 15, 2008)

JustMe said:


> 10-15 minutes from mixing can have a noticeable enough difference at times that I don't care to work with it without remixing. Can do that again if working with things that are taking time to use the mud up.
> 
> If a pail never lasts you more than 1/2 hour, sounds like you've got easy jobs, and someone to take care of the small stuff.


I'm not sure we are doing the same type job  
My scheduled procedures might be lined up a little different then yours allowing me to be at a production level of finishing 2000 sqft in a 5 hr. day on average on entire job. 

More then likely your detailing at times that create your issue of spending to much time at the mixer and your material not being consistent. :yes:

We all have different procedures to complete the same job and this is where there is a big variance in time and effort working the material to complete is so different between finishers. :thumbsup:

I could go into details on my procedures but that would be like telling you my wife's recipe to her 3 layer Napoleons and boy are they good. Maybe there's one detail I just divulged  

The biggest problem is how do you teach and old dog a new trick?
Most that have been doing this trade are set in there ways or there changing there methods over and over again to speed up productions and never really work on a method or procedure long enough to prefect it.

The tool makers and material formulas from the manufactures don't help ether as they drop another new tool or mix up a new formula in front of your face and your changing your method again. 

Its a greed thing I think seeing how others can do the twice the job in half the time is the big influences to try something new. 

Time and procedure is the only real benefit you have to over come some of the changing issues in this industry. 

Its like a computer or software that runs well it if it works don't upgrade or update anything or something will [email protected] up


----------



## JDPugh (Oct 26, 2015)

Bazooka-Joe said:


> if ya fill bevel as you wipe tape and 2 on top that's three is it not, just think dem blokes say it differently


Yeah I think that is it. Our finishers called the layers of typical level 4 job
1: Tape & Coat (Filled the bevel)
2: Bed
3: Skim


----------



## MrWillys (Mar 10, 2014)

We called level 4, Tape, top, skim, and tight skim.


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

Mudstar said:


> More then likely your detailing at times that create your issue of spending to much time at the mixer and your material not being consistent. :yes:


Naw, it's the mud.   One kind in particular, that I and some others I know ask to not be sent to jobsites, because it sometimes can be decent, other times not so much. But it still at times does get sent out. 




Mudstar said:


> The biggest problem is how do you teach and old dog a new trick?


To my way of thinking, a bigger problem than that is finding new tricks worthwhile teaching, learning - ones that old dogs will look at and say That makes sense enough to learn, or at least try. Could give a few recent examples on that. 

Back later on some other things you said.


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

Mudstar said:


> I'm not sure we are doing the same type job
> My scheduled procedures might be lined up a little different then yours allowing me to be at a production level of finishing 2000 sqft in a 5 hr. day on average on entire job.


On this, sounds like you're right. Mine come in all shapes, sizes, mostly in commercial.


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

Mudstar said:


> I'm not sure we are doing the same type job.....


Having gone over again what you said, I'd say you over generalized on a # of things to make your points - which makes them more conditional truths - conditional on circumstances. My circumstances often don't fit overly well with what you seem to be saying - which you mentioned in your 1st sentence. Neither does my motivation for why I do some things fit overly well with what you said - eg. your "greed thing" reasoning. 

Not pointing fingers. Over generalizing is something that's common when people want to make/win a point. We can often not even realize we're doing it - which can cause it to mislead ourselves as well as others. Been there, done that. Still at it. 

I can go through a few examples in what you wrote if it's wanted/needed, but it's not a big deal to me. I'll let others see if they can pick the generalizations out, if they'd care to.

------

edit: Btw, more power to you for finding a system that works so well for you. Don't blame you for not wanting to share.


----------



## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

JustMe said:


> Don't blame you for not wanting to share.


SHARE WHAT? :blink: It's just ****in Drywall!!!


----------



## Bazooka-Joe (Dec 31, 2010)

Mudstar said:


> I'm not sure we are doing the same type job
> My scheduled procedures might be lined up a little different then yours allowing me to be at a production level of finishing 2000 sqft in a 5 hr. day on average on entire job.
> 
> More then likely your detailing at times that create your issue of spending to much time at the mixer and your material not being consistent. :yes:
> ...


 
piss me urf windows 7 ya can boost ram from command prompt then 8 and 10 wont alow it


----------



## JustMe (Apr 17, 2009)

moore said:


> SHARE WHAT? :blink: It's just ****in Drywall!!!


Share the details of his procedures.




Mudstar said:


> We all have different procedures to complete the same job and this is where there is a big variance in time and effort working the material to complete is so different between finishers. :thumbsup:
> 
> I could go into details on my procedures but that would be like telling you my wife's recipe to her 3 layer Napoleons and boy are they good. Maybe there's one detail I just divulged


----------

