# certainteed products



## big george (Feb 7, 2009)

What are the ploblems with there board and mud?


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

big george said:


> What are the ploblems with there board and mud?


Not a issue with their mud, I actually like their mud:yes:

The issue comes with their board, and it's only certain factories where the issues are happening. Think the one plant is in Mississauga, CAN. and in Virginia, USA.,,,, there could be other plants too.

Main issue is with the CD board (48"x12'x1/2" thick) and the 54" board(54"x12'x1/2"). Biggest issue is the high shoulders at the bevell, they reside too high, meaning you half to build them out to Butt joint size. Second issue is the slang term I call tiger striping. Looks like the stripes of a tiger or zebra, that run the length of the sheets. You may notice them when you coat your screws, but they will really stand out when you sand (dust makes them stand out). You half to skim coat out the WHOLE sheet to hide them. (level 5)

So it depends on which plant your getting your rock from:yes:


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## jcampbell (Aug 26, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> Not a issue with their mud, I actually like their mud:yes:
> 
> The issue comes with their board, and it's only certain factories where the issues are happening. Think the one plant is in Mississauga, CAN. and in Virginia, USA.,,,, there could be other plants too.
> 
> ...


I found that the top edge of my flats and bottoms of my angles were a bit humped. Would this be caused by the high shoulders or is my box in new of a tuneup? Seems always on the too edge of the seams. I just skimmed the too half and it was good. I did find running my 10 that there definitely were high shoulders. The bevels were also different on the 54's . One sheet would have a square edge and some had a rounded off edge With a shallower bevel. Had to run a 3rd pass on a few of my upper angles because the bevel didn't fill after 2nd pass. That could also be my own fault as I didn't pre fill the bevels but where there was a bevel on the ceiling side no issue.


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

jcampbell said:


> I found that the top edge of my flats and bottoms of my angles were a bit humped. Would this be caused by the high shoulders or is my box in new of a tuneup? Seems always on the too edge of the seams. I just skimmed the too half and it was good. I did find running my 10 that there definitely were high shoulders. The bevels were also different on the 54's . One sheet would have a square edge and some had a rounded off edge With a shallower bevel. Had to run a 3rd pass on a few of my upper angles because the bevel didn't fill after 2nd pass. That could also be my own fault as I didn't pre fill the bevels but where there was a bevel on the ceiling side no issue.


Can't answer your box issue, but for the high shoulders, say there is nothing wrong with your boxes. Your box will fill the bevell, then you will see bare drywall, then a heavy edge. Another example is what a joint looks like with a heavy crown/bow on the wall that is framed in with wood.Sure you know about wood framing, where studs are to be laid crown up, not crown down. So if you know what a joint looks like when there's a high crown, well with high shoulders, the whole house will look like that......

As for your angles, I have heard some on here say the 54' bevells are wider than the 48" rock. Not that I have checked, but if true, a 2.5 wiper may work fine on 48" board, but not the 54" (too small)

But I would not concern yourself with pre-filling the top horizontal bevells, lets face it, most people are too fat and lazy to climb something to check them:whistling2:. With your up-rights/verticals then yes, you could end up with issues there. Verticals are more pron to light refraction or flashing.... Angles are the best place to go to if you want to pick apart a taper, but the same holds true for the painter too, so you can always pass the BUCK back at the painter too, as long as the painter is not you....... Were just suppose to make it LOOK like the joints and fasteners are hidden, were not there to make the walls level:whistling2:

So are the leafs going to win to night, their all injured right now


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## jcampbell (Aug 26, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> Can't answer your box issue, but for the high shoulders, say there is nothing wrong with your boxes. Your box will fill the bevell, then you will see bare drywall, then a heavy edge. Another example is what a joint looks like with a heavy crown/bow on the wall that is framed in with wood.Sure you know about wood framing, where studs are to be laid crown up, not crown down. So if you know what a joint looks like when there's a high crown, well with high shoulders, the whole house will look like that......
> 
> As for your angles, I have heard some on here say the 54' bevells are wider than the 48" rock. Not that I have checked, but if true, a 2.5 wiper may work fine on 48" board, but not the 54" (too small)
> 
> ...


Really the angles are usually the worst. . I usually check out the ceilings to see how good a taper is. That where you see the most issues from my experience. Ya I know what your talking about with the hard edges and seeing the edge of te taper. There wasn't a whole lot of that. But when I ran my hand down across the flat from edge to edge them back up, I could feel a depression at the top but it was a smooth transition along the bottom edge. I'm thinking its my box and my seams are actually looking like this. (Slightly exaggerated )


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## jcampbell (Aug 26, 2012)

And yes. The leafs are going to win tonight. Even with a backup goalie


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

jcampbell said:


> Really the angles are usually the worst. . I usually check out the ceilings to see how good a taper is. That where you see the most issues from my experience. Ya I know what your talking about with the hard edges and seeing the edge of te taper. There wasn't a whole lot of that. But when I ran my hand down across the flat from edge to edge them back up, I could feel a depression at the top but it was a smooth transition along the bottom edge. I'm thinking its my box and my seams are actually looking like this. (Slightly exaggerated )


Should be able to tell if it's your boxes, yes we have a perferred way to run them (left to right or right to left), but we do half to flip them over to run them, you should notice right away by eye something is not right,,,, but always make sure your pins are running free.

I find most guys goes through the motions with their box work, instead of paying attention to what the shoulders are doing. with 8' high walls, and properly rocked steel stud, you can get away with it. But when it comes to trusses, and wood framed walls 9" and higher, the game can change.

If you run your box, and you see at the edges, a inch of grey at top and bottom, then all is good. But if you run your box and see a inch of grey at bottom, but white at the top, run your box higher.

The pic with the balck lines, is how I would do my next box run, examine the edges, their talking to you:thumbup:


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

Here's something for you to think about with the angles..

I use the 2.5 drywall master angle head when installing tapes. The first pic I put a load of mud on the one side, (like spotting screws). The second pic is after I have wiped the mud off. If I went around and did this to all the angles, and sanded them (very lightly), they would pass. But it would take too long to do that by hand, so I flush/glaze them by machine. All you half to hide is that edge of the tape:yes:

So ask yourself, how much mud do you need to put on when you flush/glaze.

We are not the finish product, the paint is:yes:

here's some sites for leaf games online http://forum.wiziwig.eu/forum.php nutjob feed usually works.

Another one http://www.streamhunter.eu/


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## jcampbell (Aug 26, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> Here's something for you to think about with the angles..
> 
> I use the 2.5 drywall master angle head when installing tapes. The first pic I put a load of mud on the one side, (like spotting screws). The second pic is after I have wiped the mud off. If I went around and did this to all the angles, and sanded them (very lightly), they would pass. But it would take too long to do that by hand, so I flush/glaze them by machine. All you half to hide is that edge of the tape:yes:
> 
> ...


Ya I understand. I'm just used to hand taping and having wide 6" flat as hell angles . Feeling the bevel kinda makes me nervous. I built and finished a 5000sqf house a few years ago in Alberta (cochrane/beau pre creek actually) and the drywall was subbed out to can do drywall. There was the odd standup 10' and they put the bevels in the inside corners. I could see everyone and had to fix them myself along with all their other ****ups? I did however leave a few of these angles only 2 coated where I could feel the bevel in the house I just did. It's not being finished till spring but it is now all sprayed. I will keep an eye on it throughout the day to see if it can be noticed. Hard with no finish paint tho . I understand about the flat boxes too. I guess they really do talk. I still however feel they are a bit out of wack but I didn't keep track of which way I ran them but I prefer left to right when I can and do 2 passes with the first pas being right to left first if I can . I will keep track on the next job. Will the blade wearing down on one side a bit more than the other make much oh a difference . My ten is needing replacement soon I think. Worn flat about an inch on both ends. 12 seems ok the 10 i Have to run it on one almost always . Anything more would be flat and no room for shrinkage. Splitting buts wide open is ok but I'm thinking changing the blade will help.


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## 2buckcanuck (Jul 9, 2010)

jcampbell said:


> Ya I understand. I'm just used to hand taping and having wide 6" flat as hell angles . Feeling the bevel kinda makes me nervous. I built and finished a 5000sqf house a few years ago in Alberta (cochrane/beau pre creek actually) and the drywall was subbed out to can do drywall. There was the odd standup 10' and they put the bevels in the inside corners. I could see everyone and had to fix them myself along with all their other ****ups? I did however leave a few of these angles only 2 coated where I could feel the bevel in the house I just did. It's not being finished till spring but it is now all sprayed. I will keep an eye on it throughout the day to see if it can be noticed. Hard with no finish paint tho . I understand about the flat boxes too. I guess they really do talk. I still however feel they are a bit out of wack but I didn't keep track of which way I ran them but I prefer left to right when I can and do 2 passes with the first pas being right to left first if I can . I will keep track on the next job. Will the blade wearing down on one side a bit more than the other make much oh a difference . My ten is needing replacement soon I think. Worn flat about an inch on both ends. 12 seems ok the 10 i Have to run it on one almost always . Anything more would be flat and no room for shrinkage. Splitting buts wide open is ok but I'm thinking changing the blade will help.


yes, I would change the blades, and get new shoes just to be safe. if who ever ran your boxes before, was running them on the shoes, then that could affect them too.

You know what the shoes are???? right:blink:

2nd period begins:thumbup:,,,0-0


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## jcampbell (Aug 26, 2012)

2buckcanuck said:


> yes, I would change the blades, and get new shoes just to be safe. if who ever ran your boxes before, was running them on the shoes, then that could affect them too.
> 
> You know what the shoes are???? right:blink:
> 
> 2nd period begins:thumbup:,,,0-0


Ya I got lots of shoes and a new blade when I bought the boxes. . They are old silver Columbia boxes. I just got an old 8 from eBay that matches. Needs a blade tho. The 12 and 10 must be a bit older because the 8 that I got has the black plastic wheels with the rubber o ring and the other ones have just the white plastic. No rubber. 

Tied 1-1


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

jcampbell said:


> I found that the top edge of my flats and bottoms of my angles were a bit humped. Would this be caused by the high shoulders or is my box in new of a tuneup? Seems always on the too edge of the seams. I just skimmed the too half and it was good. I did find running my 10 that there definitely were high shoulders. The bevels were also different on the 54's . One sheet would have a square edge and some had a rounded off edge With a shallower bevel. Had to run a 3rd pass on a few of my upper angles because the bevel didn't fill after 2nd pass. That could also be my own fault as I didn't pre fill the bevels but where there was a bevel on the ceiling side no issue.


Are you fixing [using] Certainteed board JC? We were getting our Certainteed board from West Virginia up untill a year 1/2 ago...It was trash...:thumbup:....Our certainteed board now comes from Duram North Carolina.. A better board .., but not by much still an issue with the shoulders but not as bad...

National Gypsum is A crap boad also .. It's a soft crumbley board with loose paper on the factory butts but there recess is perfect every time..no high shoulders on the N/G regular board ..The N/G l/w board along with all the other l/w boards have high shoulders .
The l/w boards are weak.both USG and N/G the shoulders are high and hollow ....IMO...L/W will be a thing of the past very soon..
I hope:thumbup:



The last 2 homes I got USG board The field of the board was rippled with tigger stripes but a nice recess Whatta ya do? It's crazy..


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## jcampbell (Aug 26, 2012)

moore said:


> Are you fixing [using] Certainteed board JC? We were getting our Certainteed board from West Virginia up untill a year 1/2 ago...It was trash...:thumbup:....Our certainteed board now comes from Duram North Carolina.. A better board .., but not by much still an issue with the shoulders but not as bad...
> 
> National Gypsum is A crap boad also .. It's a soft crumbley board with loose paper on the factory butts but there recess is perfect every time..no high shoulders on the N/G regular board ..The N/G l/w board along with all the other l/w boards have high shoulders .
> The l/w boards are weak.both USG and N/G the shoulders are high and hollow ....IMO...L/W will be a thing of the past very soon..
> ...


Well yes now that I'm running boxes. My flats would used to be 20-24" wide before an no issues. Boxes are a diff story I guess. This was my first house with tools so I'm learning a lot about ****ty board. Didn't notice and striping tho. But ends were good and square but bevels were different with with square and round edges and diff depths between the two . Funny if ya look at the dates and times there is only 45mins apart . That's ****ed!!!! The 48 inch board seed ok but the 54 was different. Ya could tell when just wiping tapes.


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## moore (Dec 2, 2010)

jcampbell said:


> Well yes now that I'm running boxes. My flats would used to be 20-24" wide before an no issues. Boxes are a diff story I guess. This was my first house with tools so I'm learning a lot about ****ty board. Didn't notice and striping tho. But ends were good and square but bevels were different with with square and round edges and diff depths between the two . Funny if ya look at the dates and times there is only 45mins apart . That's ****ed!!!! The 48 inch board seed ok but the 54 was different. Ya could tell when just wiping tapes.


http://www.drywalltalk.com/f7/fyi-high-shoulders-cupping-3257/


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## carpentaper (Feb 28, 2009)

our certainteed board here is "acceptable". often it has round edges sometimes high shoulders but not to pronounced although i'm always hand finishing my flats due to volume. i rarely use cgc unless i'm picking up a few sheets from HD but i always like it. GP tough rock has the best bevel of all the cheaper boards here, always square and tight maybe just a little shallow sometimes. GP is very crumbly but i don't really care because it stops crumbling when its up on the wall. the paper is ugly but all the more reason to upsale a level 5.


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